Street Fighter V Combo Engine Investigation

[Doopliss]

I have no idea how to understand the JP system but I wondered why I couldn't do qcf MK xx qcfx2 P on a juggled opponent with Necalli if it was from a dp LP. The super would whiff.

But if I did it from say, his target combo, it would combo. In that case, how much JP would that dp LP be?

When it comes to the stomp, it's more about them slamming into the ground before the super becomes active unless you hit them REALLY high up with it.

I'm pretty sure I've been stomping the opponent higher than from the juggle from the target combo and it still whiffs but I'm also getting images in my head that I've connected it before. Damn, guess I'll try again to be sure but after a long while I just gave up and left the stomp out of the video.

I'm sure you can find situations that it doesn't work for JP reasons as well, it's just hard to tell at times.

[Pokey86]

I'm pretty sure I've been stomping the opponent higher than from the juggle from the target combo and it still whiffs but I'm also getting images in my head that I've connected it before. Damn, guess I'll try again to be sure but after a long while I just gave up and left the stomp out of the video.

Specifically what combo are you doing? & how you setting it up.

Necallis DP adds 2 JP on first hit, (All of them) his stomp is JP 2 (Possibly more but doubtful) & his Super is JP3 (Possibly more, possibly JPX)

As far as i know the combo works.

EDIT Yup, definitely works.

Vs Sim Jump MK

LP DP Trade -> LK or MK Stomp -> Super

EDIT2 - Necallis Target combo causes float state on second hit & maintains it on third, so nion anything you do after will combo.

[Persona]

I'm pretty sure I've been stomping the opponent higher than from the juggle from the target combo and it still whiffs but I'm also getting images in my head that I've connected it before. Damn, guess I'll try again to be sure but after a long while I just gave up and left the stomp out of the video.

Specifically what combo are you doing? & how you setting it up.

Necallis DP adds 2 JP on first hit, (All of them) his stomp is JP 2 (Possibly more but doubtful) & his Super is JP3 (Possibly more, possibly JPX)

As far as i know the combo works.

EDIT Yup, definitely works.

Vs Sim Jump MK

LP DP Trade -> LK or MK Stomp -> Super

EDIT2 - Necallis Target combo causes float state on second hit & maintains it on third, so nion anything you do after will combo.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlFpl4lE9yU

The combo at 00:23.

I think when I was able to connect it, I didn't add in the jump attack. But with the jump attack, I could never seem to get the super to connect. Can you check please?

[Pokey86]

Do you mean

Jump MP -> LP SRK -> [trade] -> stomp -> Super

Theoretically it works, but i'll take a look & get back to you

If you mean to Jump MP's then a MP SRK then i'm not 100% sure as i haven't tested to see if SRK's act the same against a juggled target (As it seems to be common for SRK's to alter quite a bit in hitting an airborne vs juggled opponent in SFV)

[Persona]

jump HP, HP xx dp LP (trade), qcf MK xx qcfx2 P on a standing opponent. I assume it should work considering the opponent wasn't juggled yet.

[Pokey86]

I don't need to test it to tell you that will 100% work, better off using LK Stomp though, as it comes out faster, should make the super hit easier

[Maj]

In case you guys haven't seen it yet ...

SF5 R.Mika Combo Video by izumojin

Some neat stuff. Alpha Counter combos are always fun to see. And looks like Mika's fully charged command grab is SF5's Final Tap double ultra setup (just way more restrictive).

[Pokey86]

In case you guys haven't seen it yet ...

SF5 R.Mika Combo Video by izumojin

Some neat stuff. Alpha Counter combos are always fun to see. And looks like Mika's fully charged command grab is SF5's Final Tap double ultra setup (just way more restrictive).

any of mika's throws fully charged is an instant kill, he's done the second to last level. Even just tapping her v-trigger without charging buffs all her throws. Loved the EX ass-dive interrupt combo & the Alpha counter combo, a shame it didn't go in to animation though

[Dark_Chaotix]

is it my understanding that you cant have counter hit on, if you are replaying a recording of an opponent

[Doopliss]

is it my understanding that you cant have counter hit on, if you are replaying a recording of an opponent

Yeah. Counterhit is designed to simulate an action by the opponent. If you could have counterhit on during recordings, you could get counterhits in scenarios where it's normally impossible, like during the recovery of a normal (most notably Dhalsim limbs). You'll have to set up a natural counterhit during a recording.

[Caj814]

I had an inquiry about something not exactly combo related. Is there any info available on how command throws vs normal throws work when they both happen on the same frame? I know error did a video for SF4 and was curious on if the same randomness occurred in 5.
https://youtu.be/lea9o487UpU

[Doopliss]

A lot of core elements in SFV seem identical to SFIV, so I wouldn't be surprised if it applied to this as well. But it would be nice if someone confirmed it I guess.

[phoenix]

https://youtu.be/ls_QFXxFNW0?t=1m55s

So Laura has weird extra hitstun if you hit attacks meaty too. st.lk XX qcf+MP doesn't normally work, but with a meaty st.LK it does. So it doesn't seem to just be an odd property of Necalli's cr.MP, but an actual "feature". Someone is going to have to figure out how this works at some point.

[onReload]

Why does that seem weird? Don't meaty attacks work that way in every game, that you recover earlier than normal so you have more frame advantage?

[Doopliss]

Why does that seem weird? Don't meaty attacks work that way in every game, that you recover earlier than normal so you have more frame advantage?

For links, yes. Not for cancels. That's why you never saw stuff like meaty FA xx dash into something in SFIV, because it doesn't earn you any extra frame advantage since the cancel still happens at the same time relative to when the opponent was hit, and it still has the same amount of hitstun.

This thing in SFV reminds me of a glitch in JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: All-Star Battle where move A normally wouldn't combo if cancelled into move B, but it WOULD combo if you cancelled move B with stand rush during its start-up (de-syncing from your stand so that it keeps doing the move while you're free to do whatever), like in this combo, where hit 9 wouldn't combo into hit 10 if I didn't cancel out of the move.

[onReload]

Oooh, okay. yeah that's interesting, almost like they're rewarding meaties intentionally even more. Send this info to ultradavid I'm sure he'd appreciate it.

[phoenix]

Considering SF5's focus on keeping everything 'simple', I think they wanted to avoid having to do frame perfect meaties for certain meaty combos to work. To remedy this, they gave later active frames more hitstun than the first active frames. As a result, if you managed to hit a move meaty at all, you'd get the maximum frame advantage you can get off a meaty, or something like that. But the "unfortunate" result is that now you suddenly have frame perfect meaty-only combos if you cancel.

Someone should really sit down and see how it works out in the specifics. I don't have a fast enough computer to do 60fps recordings, but it should be testable.

[Pokey86]

Even though i thoroughly enjoy playing this competetively... My god is the combat system on this game uninspired.

[pepopulo]

The amount of shit Capcom pulled behind the scenes so you can't have fun is retarded,like...I'm finding some semi-interesting setups only to be throw away 5 mins later because you can't get nothing much interesting from them,for example this just happend to me:
-Mess around in training mode with Ken
-Discover that only the 2nd hit f his fireball add jp
-with a stupidly specific spacing I can get a CC cr.HP into a ex fireball so that the 2nd hit misses and I still have a free juggle
-only can juggle the 2nd hit of LK tatsu (and well, MK tatsu with proper timing, but you can't get much after it)
-2nd hit of LK tatsu adds 2 jp
I still can get something interesting from that for my vid, but really, just...FML

[onReload]

Weird thing with R. Mika -

f+HP xx V-Trigger (above), once Nadeshiko hits, I can't get a regular Wingless Airplane (qcf+k) to juggle. Nadeshiko hits the opponent, and Mika just sort of pushes them. But I found that, if timed just right, getting Nadeshiko and Wingless Airplane to hit simultaneously works (3-hit combo).

Anyone know why this is?

[Doopliss]

Weird thing with R. Mika -

f+HP xx V-Trigger (above), once Nadeshiko hits, I can't get a regular Wingless Airplane (qcf+k) to juggle. Nadeshiko hits the opponent, and Mika just sort of pushes them. But I found that, if timed just right, getting Nadeshiko and Wingless Airplane to hit simultaneously works (3-hit combo).

Anyone know why this is?

Maybe it doesn't work because of juggle properties, but when you get the simultaneous hits, both will connect?

[Pokey86]

she can hit during the start up of rope throw & doesn't alter the JP in any way, i imagine Wingless is the same, perhaps something to do with atypical throws or a side effect of her wierd OTG properties perhaps.

As for the JP

Lady Mika makes SKD, Nadashiko makes it +2 and Wingless is only JP1

[Doopliss]

she can hit during the start up of rope throw & doesn't alter the JP in any way, i imagine Wingless is the same, perhaps something to do with atypical throws or a side effect of her wierd OTG properties perhaps.

As for the JP

Lady Mika makes SKD, Nadashiko makes it +2 and Wingless is only JP1

In that case it's definitely simultaneous hits that come into play. after f.HP both moves can connect, so they do, at the same frame. Then airplane resolves since its triggering hit has already connected.

[onReload]

she can hit during the start up of rope throw & doesn't alter the JP in any way

What do you mean by this? How would she hit during the start-up of rope throw?

[Doopliss]

she can hit during the start up of rope throw & doesn't alter the JP in any way

What do you mean by this? How would she hit during the start-up of rope throw?

I guess he means something like doing f.MP xx f.MP, then side Nadeshiko hits during hitstop of rope throw before it initiates.

[Pokey86]

https://youtu.be/bYvww1WTfZM


What would happen if you hit simultanious with a knockdown & a reset move? say for example

Lady Mika -> Jump HP + Nadashiko -> Reset or Knockdown?

Pissed about but can't seem to get anything other than a reset, if it keeps juggle would make for a quirky combo.

[Doopliss]

https://youtu.be/bYvww1WTfZM


What would happen if you hit simultanious with a knockdown & a reset move? say for example

Lady Mika -> Jump HP + Nadashiko -> Reset or Knockdown?

Pissed about but can't seem to get anything other than a reset, if it keeps juggle would make for a quirky combo.

probably reset, from what I've seen the dislocated moves like projectiles tend to get beat out by normals/physical specials for hit reactions in same frame situations.

[pepopulo]

Holy shit finally finished my first SFV video(well, 2nd if you count Karin's), and there's some stuff there that I want to discuss later here,I'll upload it tomorrow (well, tomorow, it's 6am here, so today,but I need sleep),I'm "proud" with this one (pun,you'll get it after the upload,I guess). Also, Ibuki is fun but hard

Edit:Stit, fucking copyright, this is gonna take me a while
Edit2: I tried a lot of songs, finally found on that is okayish and doesn't ban the video anywhere
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZROtlmKPkes
now, can we talk about that Laura post EX Elbow combo? is it like SFIV's barlog post ex dash straight stuff? I couldn't do it with anyone else,altho I haven't tried barlog

[HarlequinRogue]

That editing with the Mika combo..... Was pretty interesting. Was thinking though it would've been ridiculously hard to time the actions in the background for it to be seamless. That was my sanity check

That whiffed kick in the 2nd Alex vid was pretty cool.

I think you need to explain some of the cooler stuff. I didn't realise how weird some of the stuff was like the Bison combo if I didn't read the Youtube comments

[Maj]

Really cool video. I didn't even notice the color edit stuff until the third time i watched it.

Why did you have Laura poisoned at 0:45? Also what do you gain from armoring into the Dhalsim fireball at 3:23? Does that replace her normal hit pause or something?