SFxT Combo Engine Investigation

[error1]

and for my own amusement rolento
it seems many of these are poorly named and some are not used
Rolento JP

5lp 1
5mp 2
5hp 3
5lk 1
5mk 2
5hk 3
5lpf 1
5mpf 2
5hpf 3
5lkf 1
5mkf 2
5hkf 3, 3
2lp 1
2mp 2,2,2
2hp 3
2lk 1
2mk 2
2hk 3
8lp 1
8mp 2,2,2
8hp 3
8lk 1
8mk 2
8hk 3
9lp 1
9mp 2,2,2
9hp 3
9lk 1
9mk 2
9hk 3
action286 1 (unused?)
Launch 3
TC_LAUNCH 0
Guard_cancel 63,63,63,63,63,63,63
6mk 2
92mk 2
82mk 2
72mk 2
CROSS_ARTS 3
deltaattackroll lmh 3
deltaattackroll ex 3,3,3,3,3,3,3,3
deltaairraid lmh ex 3
action 381 3 (unused?)
action 382 3 (unused?)
action 383 3 (unused?)
sc_lv1_lmh 5,5,5,5 (Patriot Circle) not sure how it works, and what part goes where
sc_lv_l2 5,5,5,5
sc_lv_m2 5,5,5,8
sc_lv_h2 5,6,7,8
sc_lv_l3 3,3,3
sc_lv_m3 9,a,b
sc_lv_h3 9,a,b
SC_Lv2_L/M/H 6,6,6,6,6,6,6
SC_LV2_EX 6,6,6,6,6,6,6
SC_LV3 4,4,4
SC_SA 4,4,4
SC_Lv3_ATK1_A 5,6,7,8
SC_Lv3_ATK2_A 9,a,b,c
SC_Lv3_ATK1_B 5,6,7,8
SC_Lv3_ATK2_B 9,a,b,c
SC_SA_CROSS_ARTS 4,4,4
TC_5lp 1
tc_5mp 2
TC_5hp 3
TC_5lk 1
TC_5mk 2
TC_5hk 3
TC_5lpf 1
TC_5mpf 2
TC_5hpf 3,3
TC_5lkf 1
TC_5mkf 2
TC_5hkf 3
TC_2lp 1
TC_2mp 2,2,2
TC_2hp 3
TC_2lk 1
TC_2mk 2
TC_2hk 3

[Snoooootch]

Idk if you guys have the SFxT Guide, but I was given a link for a PDF copy of it: https://www.onlinefilefolder.com/4s618gEX5Tdfsm let me know if it works. If not, I can reupload it somewhere on a zip file.

[Doopliss]

Idk if you guys have the SFxT Guide, but I was given a link for a PDF copy of it: https://www.onlinefilefolder.com/4s618gEX5Tdfsm let me know if it works. If not, I can reupload it somewhere on a zip file.

I just ordered the physical copy, d'oh.

EDIT: Apparently they decided they wouldn't carry it after all after I had ordered it, so I'll download this I guess.

[Rufus]

The tekken characters look to have tons of frame advantage and hit stun. Looks like Jin's Shun Masatsu causes 28 frames of hit stun and is cancelable. Wonder what they had to do to prevent dash cancel loops.

Looks like Jin's special move-> dash cancel takes 26 frames, (snoootche's guide, pl 32) so, without a counterhit, that leaves him at +2.

Hmm...
Can Hugo loop Crouching Strong xx Ex Clap?

[Doopliss]

The tekken characters look to have tons of frame advantage and hit stun. Looks like Jin's Shun Masatsu causes 28 frames of hit stun and is cancelable. Wonder what they had to do to prevent dash cancel loops.

Looks like Jin's special move-> dash cancel takes 26 frames, (snoootche's guide, pl 32) so, without a counterhit, that leaves him at +2.

Hmm...
Can Hugo loop Crouching Strong xx Ex Clap?

he can probably od it twice, like with normal clap.

[Q80Warlock]

OMG, yeah, with Hugo in the corner, Ken can do jump in hk, then jumping, combo 3 air ex tatsus, then land and do his target combo to lp shoryuken, then juggle with cr. lp, to lk tatsu, then juggle with autocorrect hp shoryuken. I landed everything till the autocorrect shoryuken, but I know it works.

Is it me or does the combo somehow mess up the damage scaling, unless more air hits=lesser damage scaling overall in SFxT.

[wolverine-master]

Thats exactly what it is. I have a long ass 15hit combo with Asuka....303 damage. Another 8hit combo....304 damage. The less hits, the better?
More hits mean more meter, but more scaling. Which is worth it?

[Doopliss]

Thats exactly what it is. I have a long ass 15hit combo with Asuka....303 damage. Another 8hit combo....304 damage. The less hits, the better?
More hits mean more meter, but more scaling. Which is worth it?

Just like SFIV, this game scales per move, not per hit. If you have one move that has 10 hits, it will only scale once, unless it has a manual follow-up, in which case that will scale seperately. The trick to optimalize damage in this game is to do a few powerful hits into super/cross art, or do a really long combo with powerful moves being the first 5-6 moves.

Hmm, I wonder when we'll start seeing Dhalsim interrupt combos like the ones you can see in older VS games.

[Rufus]

Thats exactly what it is. I have a long ass 15hit combo with Asuka....303 damage. Another 8hit combo....304 damage. The less hits, the better?
More hits mean more meter, but more scaling. Which is worth it?

Just like SFIV, this game scales per move, not per hit. If you have one move that has 10 hits, it will only scale once, unless it has a manual follow-up, in which case that will scale seperately. The trick to optimalize damage in this game is to do a few powerful hits into super/cross art, or do a really long combo with powerful moves being the first 5-6 moves.

It's also got the 100,100,80,70,60,50... damage scaling so stuff at the end does next to no damage.

[Snoooootch]

Well, for what its worth, toro and muro are easy to kill with one combo.

[error1]

Looks like Jin's special move-> dash cancel takes 26 frames, (snoootche's guide, pl 32) so, without a counterhit, that leaves him at +2.

looks like yoshi has the quickest dash cancel, at 21 frames but no good use for it.
bison, poison, asuka, Hwoarang, Marduk, Raven, Steve, Xiaoyu all have 22 frames

[error1]

bison cl.hp causes 25 hitstun, so 22 frames dash cancel, cl.lk might be possible, might loop even
poison cl.hp, cl.hk cause 25 hitstun
Asuka Whiplash to Toe Kick causes 29 hitstun, should give her around +7
Hwoarang Flamingo hp causes 25 but don't know if he can follow up with his three frame Flamingo jab
Steve cl.hp and c.hp cause 25, has a three frame super
Xiaoyu c.hp causes 25 but no three frame move

asuka seems like the best proof of concept, but poison's should be really good if 25 hit stun is enough to link a cl.lp

[Doopliss]

Well, for what its worth, toro and muro are easy to kill with one combo.

They have that low health? We need to do some 200% combos on them XD

bison cl.hp causes 25 hitstun, so 22 frames dash cancel, cl.lk might be possible, might loop even

Acually, I don't think you have enough time to charge. Maybe if you really utilize the hitstun of the two cl.HPs to charge (you probably know a lot more about stuff like that then me since you've used tool assistance). And that's only if you're close enough to get cl.HP after cl.LK. Assuming the charge time for Dobule Knee Press is 55 frames like most moves in SFIV. Dash time + cl.LK time + cl.HP start-up = 42 frames.

[error1]

you are not including hitpause in that, should add about 20 frames I think. No doubt the charge would be really tricky, and I haven't actually played the game yet. I'm just guessing that you would be able to get hp, dash, lk in the first place. capcon could prevent it pretty easy by delaying the cancel frames or other things

[Doopliss]

you are not including hitpause in that, should add about 20 frames I think. No doubt the charge would be really tricky, and I haven't actually played the game yet. I'm just guessing that you would be able to get hp, dash, lk in the first place. capcon could prevent it pretty easy by delaying the cancel frames or other things

I meant hitpause when I said hitstun, my bad. I think it's possible actually, I just think you won't be in range for cl.HP after s.LK. What interests me is if it's possible to do with EX DKP after a chain, and loop it like that. Easier to do, and probably looks really cool. I just don't know if chains add recovery or remove hitstun.

Btw, some interesting notes about quick combos:
1: They can defy charge rules (think Guile 2 is something like s.LP xx c.MK xx EX flash kick)
2: If it includes a super charge move, you can charge it (Hold all kicks while doing Balrog's quick combo 2 for an example)
3: If you do it by mistake and it's blocked, you can tag out if you want to be a little safer. Sadly the quick combo is interrupted at this point.

[CPS2]

Kazuya can put people back into a standing state from a juggle state
http://youtu.be/D3zvTs0Dy5c

[Persona]

Something for Snoooootch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L57krqIMDxw

[Snoooootch]

Hahaha, that's awesome. I kept trying with mp, but couldn't get reps. I guess the cr. mk has the better reach. That was awesome, Persona. I was wondering when you were gonna pull out the big guns. Apparently Bob has an infinite, too. With his Special punch. I got 4 reps, but I'm sure it can go for longer.

[Snoooootch]

They have that low health? We need to do some 200% combos on them XD.

It's in the Guide. Toro has 600 life, and Kuro has 750, I think idk. Can't remember.

[Doopliss]

They have that low health? We need to do some 200% combos on them XD.

It's in the Guide.

Sure about that? I can't find anything on the PS3 exclusive cast in the guide.

Btw, speed gems are useless for combo making, their effects are negated during hitstun. Bummer, so many instant jump juggles destroyed... Not to mention jump loops and imporved walk jabs.

Also, doing combos with the proficiency gems activated, yoou'll still need to have the bar required to use the move normally to be able to use it, so no EX to cross art even if you have 60% proficinelcy... this sucks. You can still do combos with mroe EX moves than normal though (you can do 5, then basically any other move, then a 6th, at 60% proficiency. I assume you can also do 2 EX into super, and then another EX move if you have some kind of Happy Birthday going on. You should also be able to do two supers into EX.)

[Snoooootch]

Ah, crap, no, I forgot, it's not on the guide. It's in the EH Chart.
http://www.eventhubs.com/guides/2012/ma ... -x-tekken/

idk why I thought it was in the Guide. Sorry.

[Snoooootch]

Awesome, I just figure out how I'll be doing combo videos. It will be 2 per week. New teams. This week will be rolento and Yoshi. But, the first video will be solo combos, and the second one will be team combos. Oh, btw, Rolento's special dash cancel juggle potential seems kinda useless. His dash is slow as heck. So is Yoshi's. So, this may be pretty hard.

[Doopliss]

Awesome, I just figure out how I'll be doing combo videos. It will be 2 per week. New teams. This week will be rolento and Yoshi. But, the first video will be solo combos, and the second one will be team combos. Oh, btw, Rolento's special dash cancel juggle potential seems kinda useless. His dash is slow as heck. So is Yoshi's. So, this may be pretty hard.

I thought Yoshi had one of the fastest ones?

[error1]

yeah yoshi has the fastest dash cancel in the game. He just doesn't have any good normal he can cancel. Rolento just has a slow dash.

[Snoooootch]

He just doesn't have any good normal he can cancel.

^ That's what I meant.

But, I found a cool combo with rolento in which I can hit an opponent in a juggle so high, that a lp rekka will hit only once, letting him link cr. mk to super right after. It works on Hugo and Kuma, so far, but it works wonders on Hugo.

[error1]

does rolento really have 11 jp on the last hit of hard rekkas? and does his launcer really have 3 jp?

[Doopliss]

Juggling with launchers seems really weird. IIRC, I couldn't do lariat, c.LP, launcher with Hugo, but lariat, c.LP xx HP clap, launcher worked.

[error1]

you can't juggle with it if you chain the launcher, you have to link it. Lots of moves have different jp if you chain them.
I figured out why the kazua infinite works. It's kind stupid the way sf4 and sfxt handles damage animations. First you specify what kind of state it puts them in, hit, blow, block, etc. Then there is an pointer to what animation to use. If the to fields don't match you end up with something like this. In this case the move causes a Blow but uses a hit animation.

[Doopliss]

you can't juggle with it if you chain the launcher, you have to link it. Lots of moves have different jp if you chain them.

Yes, but even when I linked it it doesn't work. Maybe I just chained it late or something.

[Rufus]

If you dash cancel an EX move that's been done by hitting two buttons, do you still get the counter-hit bonus on the next attack?
Similarly, can using the EX version of a super cancel move allow some characters to cancel more quickly?
(Abel's EX shoulder tackle, for example, starts 14 frames faster than the normal version, and his dash cancel window is otherwise relatively late.)