KoF Engine Research

[onReload]

the problem with that idea is that those hitboxes are from 2002, so unless they show up in 99-01, strikers aren't a factor

[Tigre III]

lol KOF 2002!! True... So that was REALLY a stupid assumption... ( if Krusan reads this, he will kill me...)

[onReload]

it is probably the only time I will ever correct anyone about kof, lol

it inspired me to load 2002 up in MAME and demo some of the H/S/DMs for myself, what in the hell is with K' and Ryo's ? the 214+C~A or 236+C~A is such a weird timing...

[Don Vecta]

it is probably the only time I will ever correct anyone about kof, lol

it inspired me to load 2002 up in MAME and demo some of the H/S/DMs for myself, what in the hell is with K' and Ryo's ? the 214+C~A or 236+C~A is such a weird timing...

qcf C~A from K' it's still easy to perform. Ryo's SDM it's kinda fucked up and so far has been one of the most impossible moves to pull out, complained a lot by most players.

BTW, people, regarding the ghost hitboxes and stuff and how it is mentioned about the strikers from 99/2001, well, 2002's engine *still* has tons of values and even sprites from 2001! We are still digging more stuff but yeah, tons of that ghostly stuff it's usually past version leftovers.

[phoenix]

the problem with that idea is that those hitboxes are from 2002, so unless they show up in 99-01, strikers aren't a factor

They show up in KOF2000. Haven't checked out 99 and 2001, but my guess is, if it's in 2000 and 2002 surely they're in 2001.

As for any properties that change with maxima's jump A. I have been unable to find anything.

What is odd though, is that on the 2k2 framdata website the move is listed as follows:
斜めジャンプＡ(6, 6+9)

6 frames startup and active frames of 6+9. This notation implies two different hitboxes in one attack while it doesn't count as a new attack. And yes after those 6 frames it's the moment the ghost box changes. But the actual hitbox seems to not change at all, and hit people with the same properties in the same way.

[Ultima]

I have nothing to add to this topic. I just wanted to ask: Where is 2k2 framedata website? Thanks.

[phoenix]

I have nothing to add to this topic. I just wanted to ask: Where is 2k2 framedata website? Thanks.

http://www.geocities.jp/kof_no_koto/kof ... index.html

It's in moonspeak though, and it's slightly incomplete. Like there are some moves that do not comply to the universal hitstop rules. Some moves do more hitstop to the opponent than to the attacker, effectively giving more hitstun. This is why cl.C > f+A doesn't work and cl.D > f+A does with Whip.

I hope to create a complete framedata & hitbox data website for 2k2 at some point but I need to figure out the ghostboxes before I continue.

[Don Vecta]

some interesting values of KOF 2002UM by AVD

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gvk7YG6a_c

[Raine]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FND_u9RKDx8

Interesting little vid with random combos and strange situations. Highlights for me: Vanessa using BC activation to avoid Iori's grab (does this work with all chars/grabs?). Chang using projectile nullification property of mash P to avoid O.Chris fullscreen projectile HSDM. May Lee hero mode backdash into DM (never thought of doing this for some reason).


Also messing around in 2k2 I noticed that there is some strange behaviour when both characters try to execute a 1f grab at the same time. Sometimes the grab will simply not execute at all (e.g. two Vice both try and use hcbx2+K on the same frame and nothing will come out regardless of on screen position). Against other chars occasionally you will get a normal instead. For example if Vice tries to use her 1f grab at the same time as Benimaru or Iori, they will get nothing but Vice will get a s.A/s.C (which can be cancelled into a grab by simply pressing another punch as the motion is stored). I didn't really research this much at all but I thought I'd mention it here anyway.

[Don Vecta]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FND_u9RKDx8

Interesting little vid with random combos and strange situations. Highlights for me: Vanessa using BC activation to avoid Iori's grab (does this work with all chars/grabs?). Chang using projectile nullification property of mash P to avoid O.Chris fullscreen projectile HSDM. May Lee hero mode backdash into DM (never thought of doing this for some reason).


Also messing around in 2k2 I noticed that there is some strange behaviour when both characters try to execute a 1f grab at the same time. Sometimes the grab will simply not execute at all (e.g. two Vice both try and use hcbx2+K on the same frame and nothing will come out regardless of on screen position). Against other chars occasionally you will get a normal instead. For example if Vice tries to use her 1f grab at the same time as Benimaru or Iori, they will get nothing but Vice will get a s.A/s.C (which can be cancelled into a grab by simply pressing another punch as the motion is stored). I didn't really research this much at all but I thought I'd mention it here anyway.

Interesting video. They gimme tons of ideas for some zero damage set ups.

[phoenix]

Also messing around in 2k2 I noticed that there is some strange behaviour when both characters try to execute a 1f grab at the same time. Sometimes the grab will simply not execute at all (e.g. two Vice both try and use hcbx2+K on the same frame and nothing will come out regardless of on screen position). Against other chars occasionally you will get a normal instead. For example if Vice tries to use her 1f grab at the same time as Benimaru or Iori, they will get nothing but Vice will get a s.A/s.C (which can be cancelled into a grab by simply pressing another punch as the motion is stored). I didn't really research this much at all but I thought I'd mention it here anyway.

Ran into this as well, having two yashiros try to grab each with hcb,f+A other yields them both doing a cl.A at the same time and trading with each other. Same goes for the Super, I believe.

I like the far C BC DM combo with whip shown in that vid. Obviously not that impressive, just never realised you could do it, it's a nice and slow hitconfirm at an incredible range, kind of neat.

[Don Vecta]

Actually, I'm planning to use many of this curious stuff (not the one displayed in the video but some inspired by them) in a video (or in the omake of NB4).

I was testing in 98 some mirror stuff, pick up Rober vs Robert and do close hcf B. Cool thing they'll do nothing BUT criss-cross each other, same O. Chris, Andy.

[Maj]

Nice video, but was it produced by KoFAlgeria or just something they nicked off a random Japanese website?

[Raine]

I believe kofalgeria channel just reuploads stuff from various places.

[Maj]

Weaksauce. Ah well, good to know.

[Buttermaker]

I was told that the white flash that occurs during counter hits is simply an annoyance, so I disabled it in the soft dip settings for GGPO's save states. Somebody complained that the counter animation is slower in the new GGPO version.

Does the flash have any effect on gameplay?

[Don Vecta]

I was told that the white flash that occurs during counter hits is simply an annoyance, so I disabled it in the soft dip settings for GGPO's save states. Somebody complained that the counter animation is slower in the new GGPO version.

Does the flash have any effect on gameplay?

Not really.

[Buttermaker]

Thanks.

[onReload]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2aegoua-x-8

Checking out the new "live" combo video, I got a question as my interest in this game has been piqued a bit:

at 3:08 or so, the Hwa Jai combo - you can combo into Dragon Backbreaker? (2363214+P) Is that only possible in BC mode?

[Raine]

HD mode is not required, it'll combo from df+B and heavy attacks.

[phoenix]

HD mode is not required, it'll combo from df+B and heavy attacks.

But only the Hard version. Or was it the Light version? Either way, it's one of the two.

[Raine]

Actually both versions will combo. It whiffs if you delay the cancel.

[phoenix]

Has anyone found this infinite before?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ood6gKIskTk

I had never seen it before, and I believe it's fully unblockable.

Also funny that, despite the proximity unblockable coming out, the move goes through completely. If you don't free cancel it, first hit hits and the following three simply whiff.

[onReload]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6949YkLwckc#t=7m21s

That Ash combo, with the double Sans-culotte - is that with infinite drive meter, or does the move allow for canceling one special into another, along with reduced charge times? i wanted to get DDTC to submit this to CV but that kind of thing is lame, as much as i'm liking this video concept

[Raine]

Nah, that's legit, Sans Culotte removes charge time and lets you perform some new cancels e.g. d~u+K into b+D or b+D into special.

[onReload]

Ahh, OK, cool. I was gonna be really saddened if it wasn't legit; I didn't think that super was worth a damn, but with that combo and watching some of the (not-so-great) KoF XIII console stream on Level|Up, it looks really good. I'm guessing nobody uses Germinal though...?

[Raine]

I've never seen anyone use it in arcade, but it's been changed in console so that it doesn't cost a meter to use anymore. I imagine it will get used a lot now to end Sans Culotte combos unless you can get the kill.

[Raine]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mv9VWDbNKkI
Made this while working on the Airthrow Exhibition, but it doesn't really fit in that thread so I thought I'd just post it here. Thanks for the idea Dark_Chaotix!

qcb+C xx qcb+AC, walk crossunder, cl.D xx hcf+BD, cl.D xx f+A xx qcb+AC, walk, st.C, hcf+BD, cl.D xx f+A xx qcb+C xx qcb+AC, f+A

Getting the first crossunder is quite tight (you have to walk because she isn't facing the right direction to run), but you can connect cl.D, cl.C, cl.B, cl.A, cr.C, cr.A. The cl.D xx hcf+BD must be a late cancel or Vice will move forward underneath the dummy and whiff the hcf+BD. You need to walk backwards to get the spacing correct to get st.C to come out rather than a whiffed cl.C. f+A does a hard knockdown on aerial hit.

[Dark_Chaotix]

Glad to be of some help / inspiration.

You can link a hcf+B after that last qcb+AC but need correct spacing which i dont think you have.

I almost had some NEW stuff with her, but my idea fell short unfortunately. It involved whiff air DM to continue a combo.

Speaking of whiff, I can whiff her NM haha.

[Raine]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lKIWisUaL8
Simple Mai combo, not much to say about this one.