Finally Done: Juggle mechanics guide

[error1]

It's in the ssf4 frame data
ppp is 1+10
and kkk is 1+9

[Maj]

Cool, that solves that nicely.

[Rufus]

I just wanted to thank you for posting the guide. I'm sure it represents a whole lot of work that you did... and that I don't have to do now.

[Pokey86]

I just wanted to thank you for posting the guide. I'm sure it represents a whole lot of work that you did... and that I don't have to do now.

Why, did you plan on doing it?

& hey irrespective Doopliss deserves alot of credit, he helped me out a hell of alot. (& Kich with his pretty good guide beforehand)

---

It's annoying waiting for AE, i want to get started on the update.

[Rufus]

Why, did you plan on doing it?

Not so much, but I don't have to test everything when I want to make a combo work.

[Doopliss]

There's some dude insisting that he saw Makoto do Fukiage to U1, is this in any way possible?

[Pokey86]

There's some dude insisting that he saw Makoto do Fukiage to U1, is this in any way possible?

Nope, but fukiage to U2 is possible.

I checked many times & U1 is most certainly JP 0. & as far as i'm aware Fukiage cannot hit ground, & has no alterations on Counterhit

[Doopliss]

The situation he was talking about fukiage beating out Ibuki's vortex, so try if there's some glitch where you can combo it if you hit both the kunai and ibuki or something.

[Pokey86]

The situation he was talking about fukiage beating out Ibuki's vortex, so try if there's some glitch where you can combo it if you hit both the kunai and ibuki or something.

I'll look in to it... But i can't see hitting the trading with the kunai then moving on to U1 would do anything

Unless you mean hit both Ibuki & the kunai, maybe making some kind of screwed up mechanic. I'll give it a go, shame though, would probably be easier in AE what with Fukiage starting faster

[Doopliss]

Unless you mean hit both Ibuki & the kunai, maybe making some kind of screwed up mechanic.

That's indeed what I mean.

[Pokey86]

Nope, no change.

[Doopliss]

Ok than, thanks.

[Pokey86]

Finally updated the SRK side of this whole thing with update notes & references to AE changes

About time to.

[Maj]

Wait, you blended the AE info with the SSF4 data? Can you post the vanilla and SSF4 stuff separately? I know it's tempting say that SF4 and SSF4 don't matter now that SSF4AE is out - but SF4 sold twice as many copies as SSF4, so it's never really going away.

[Pokey86]

Wait, you blended the AE info with the SSF4 data? Can you post the vanilla and SSF4 stuff separately? I know it's tempting say that SF4 and SSF4 don't matter now that SSF4AE is out - but SF4 sold twice as many copies as SSF4, so it's never really going away.

Hmm, good point... I'll work something out.

[Doopliss]

feedback time:

Why do DeeJay's s.HK say "fierce"?

I think you're able to juggle into the HKD+ part of DeeJay's c.HK from float now, you should test the move a little more.

It's worth specifying that EX Condor Dive has JP as well as the follow-up version, as that might easily be overlooked by some. Do we even have any proof that that version has JP2?

Sakura's EX tatsu has the 4th hit as "stun - reset".

Out of curiosity, how did you figure out Tiger Cannon works like that?

Oni.

Why did you even add Oni's f.HP?

EX Slash has JP? Nice.

You sure Oni's DP+HK has JP?

How did you come up with the JP for Oni's U2?

E.Ryu:

"
Tatsumaki Senpukyaku: LK Air

1st: JP0 - SKD - SKD (CH=Float)
2nd: JP0 - SKD - SKD*

* Cannot hit an opponent in float state"

So what you're saying is basically that you can't get 2-hit air LK tatsu?

You can juggle after air-traded HK stomp, so then it's not really HKD+?

Why is Yun before Yang if it's in alphabetic order?

[Pokey86]

Cheers, feedback is appreciated.

feedback time:

Why do DeeJay's s.HK say "fierce"?

Because i'm pro!

I think you're able to juggle into the HKD+ part of DeeJay's c.HK from float now, you should test the move a little more.

I will do

It's worth specifying that EX Condor Dive has JP as well as the follow-up version, as that might easily be overlooked by some. Do we even have any proof that that version has JP2?

eh, i left it due to laziness, i don't think it's possible for people to prove it's not JP2, so if someone proves it wrong then i'll concede but i'm prettu sure i'm safe.

Sakura's EX tatsu has the 4th hit as "stun - reset".

ouch, i'll correct that.

Out of curiosity, how did you figure out Tiger Cannon works like that?

If you hit it during float it does full 8 hits, if you hit it on SKD it does 6, ad a forward step kick, or a EX Tiger Shot after the skd & it'll hit 5 times, in fact it's hard to make it not hit 5 times. I used varying amounts of hits ofrom his super & AA EX Uppers to determine how it acts against an enemy going all the way up to JP6, i can confirm it does not hit above JP6. As for the beginning, that is the only possible methodology i could figure out to allow the move to work legitimately.

Oni.

Why did you even add Oni's f.HP?

Because it can negate projectiles, i'm pretty sure it's the only normal that can do that.

EX Slash has JP? Nice.

It's a real bastard to hit, i've heard roumers you can do EX Slash -> EX Slash, but i've yet to pull it off. I can however do LP Shaku -> FADC -> EX Slash

You sure Oni's DP+HK has JP?

Counterhit EX Slash -> HK Overhead Palm

How did you come up with the JP for Oni's U2?

I orginally did air EX Tatsu to it, which hit full, so i was just gonna go JPX & leave it as that. But then MK/HK Slash removes juggle potential so it's not JPX, i then did EX Tatsu -> EX Tatsu in the corner VS Sim & U2 ALWAYS lost one hit. So i ruled it was probably that.

E.Ryu:

"
Tatsumaki Senpukyaku: LK Air

1st: JP0 - SKD - SKD (CH=Float)
2nd: JP0 - SKD - SKD*

* Cannot hit an opponent in float state"

So what you're saying is basically that you can't get 2-hit air LK tatsu?

Yeah, i tested it a fair bit, the second hit just does not hit an enemy in float, but on landing everything hits full. (SRK for example)

You can juggle after air-traded HK stomp, so then it's not really HKD+?

I considered this, but the you can juggle after Cody's EX Ruffian, even though that causes untechable SKD. I checked all my note & i never mentioned that HKD+ removes all juggle potential, so i kept the naming convention.

Why is Yun before Yang if it's in alphabetic order?

Because i don't know my own Alphabet

[Smileymike101]

The first 21 hits of Seth's super don't increase juggle, just like gouken's hadouken.Because doing cr.hp ,then quickly do a LP super (not a cancel though) cause dhalsim to randomly get draged into the super, but not at the start.After the hits launch dhalsim too high for him to get hit, when he falls down again in the super, he'll get sucked in like he was hit on the ground, and considering that hit propriety is JP 0, it means the hits don't add on the JP counter.

[Doopliss]

The first 21 hits of Seth's super don't increase juggle, just like gouken's hadouken.Because doing cr.hp ,then quickly do a LP super (not a cancel though) cause dhalsim to randomly get draged into the super, but not at the start.After the hits launch dhalsim too high for him to get hit, when he falls down again in the super, he'll get sucked in like he was hit on the ground, and considering that hit propriety is JP 0, it means the hits don't add on the JP counter.

Huh? I've never seen this. Could you record it?

[Pokey86]

The first 21 hits of Seth's super don't increase juggle, just like gouken's hadouken.Because doing cr.hp ,then quickly do a LP super (not a cancel though) cause dhalsim to randomly get draged into the super, but not at the start.After the hits launch dhalsim too high for him to get hit, when he falls down again in the super, he'll get sucked in like he was hit on the ground, and considering that hit propriety is JP 0, it means the hits don't add on the JP counter.

Yeah, i haven't seen this either, but i did speculate to myself that the initial hits don't add to the juggle counter, finally hit, however, likely does. Makes it even more annoying that you can't interrupr the dame super. it gives you stupid amounts of options if that were possible.

It wouldn't surprise me if Dee-Jays "Tame" Ultra 2 works the same way.

[Smileymike101]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypSu50Ecg7A

[error1]

Meido Gohadou: Ultra 1 (all variations)

1st*: JP0 - Auto - Auto
2nd: JP1 - SKD - SKD
3rd: JP2 - SKD - SKD
4th: JP3 - SKD - SKD
5th: JP4 - SKD - SKD
6th: JP5 - SKD - SKD
7th: JP6 - SKD - SKD
8th: JP7 - SKD - SKD
9th: JP8 - SKD - SKD

*First hit is a close range hit, Ground PPP Activation only.

Tenchi Sokaigen: Ultra 2

1st*: JP0 - Auto - Auto
2nd: JP5 - SKD - SKD
3rd: JP6 - SKD - SKD
4th: JP7 - SKD - SKD
5th: JP8 - SKD - SKD
6th: JP9 - SKD - SKD
7th: JP10 - SKD - SKD
8th: JP11 - SKD - SKD

how did you get these numbers for oni?
I did ex tatsu ( four hit ), ex tatsu ( five hits ), u1(1 hit)/or u2(six hits)
I'm not saying your number is wrong, just wondering why I get some extra hits on u2

[Doopliss]

Meido Gohadou: Ultra 1 (all variations)

1st*: JP0 - Auto - Auto
2nd: JP1 - SKD - SKD
3rd: JP2 - SKD - SKD
4th: JP3 - SKD - SKD
5th: JP4 - SKD - SKD
6th: JP5 - SKD - SKD
7th: JP6 - SKD - SKD
8th: JP7 - SKD - SKD
9th: JP8 - SKD - SKD

*First hit is a close range hit, Ground PPP Activation only.

Tenchi Sokaigen: Ultra 2

1st*: JP0 - Auto - Auto
2nd: JP5 - SKD - SKD
3rd: JP6 - SKD - SKD
4th: JP7 - SKD - SKD
5th: JP8 - SKD - SKD
6th: JP9 - SKD - SKD
7th: JP10 - SKD - SKD
8th: JP11 - SKD - SKD

how did you get these numbers for oni?
I did ex tatsu ( four hit ), ex tatsu ( five hits ), u1(1 hit)/or u2(six hits)
I'm not saying your number is wrong, just wondering why I get some extra hits on u2

First EX tatsu doesn't actually launch until the last hit you know. After the 2nd one, you need JP6 to hit, U2 hits 6 times, U1 SHOULD hit 3 times, which it does when I try it.

[error1]

ah ok that must be my problem

[Pokey86]

T.Hawks normal Condor Dive has two low hits at JP0 (think Seth)

Hell if you are stupid enough to Focus his HP Condor you take 2 hits of 160 damage... Killer!

[Doopliss]

The reason E.Ryu air L Tatsu only hits once is because it only has one hitbox, like the cannon spike. Tried it vs Goukens air focus now, the 2nd hit passed right through after he absorbed the first one, while M and H tatsu conencted.

[Pokey86]

The reason E.Ryu air L Tatsu only hits once is because it only has one hitbox, like the cannon spike. Tried it vs Goukens air focus now, the 2nd hit passed right through after he absorbed the first one, while M and H tatsu conencted.

So it's just one, rather drawn out hit... Is there a benefit to that in any way?

[Doopliss]

It's not able to hit twice... that's about it.

[Pokey86]

Updated Oni's HK Overhead smash, it's only one hit, JP0, however it has the same side coverage as his EX smash. (It hits slightly in front at reduced damage, but it won't hit twice VS a Focus)

[Doopliss]

Looks like Yun's EX palm has JP1 or more, or JP+: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DB5hB0QpQMM