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Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 8:58 pm
by onReload
Sadly, Evil Ryu and Oni don't bring much to the combo table so far; at least that's my impression. I'm sure you'll all want to see for yourselves, but when you get the chance to try out AE, I'd recommend Yun and Yang.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:05 pm
by Snoooootch
Yup, and their Supers are straight up free combos. lol.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:11 pm
by Doopliss
I'm sure Oni can do some cool juggles, as a lot of his moves seems to cause knockdown instead of reset. Also, doesn't his air dashes have hitboxes as well?
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:39 pm
by error1
I'm sure e. ryu can do some cool things with his j.mp and akuma's hurricane kick and red fireball
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 9:52 pm
by Doopliss
Also, I bet you can use E.Ryu's stomp and/or Oni's slash in FADC combos.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 2:22 am
by onReload
the stomp doesn't seem to have much in the way of FADC, e.ryu's j.MP is indeed like ryu's j.MP, but after 2 hits (air to air), messatsu shoryuken (U2) doesn't go cinematic - didn't get to try it after 1 hit.
i'm talking ground combos, dummy opportunities, etc...their bread and butters already very close to the ones that akuma and ryu already have, their tatsus aren't better, neither are the fireballs or pokes (though Oni's f+HP negates a fireball)...i'm hopeful about the airdashes with Oni, and he seems more interesting/different than e.ryu, but still, I think what will set them apart from other character's combo potential will be their specials/ultras...which are only interesting on day 1, imo.
error1 wrote:I'm sure e. ryu can do some cool things with his j.mp and akuma's hurricane kick and red fireball
yeah, you can probably do
(juggle)j.MP, land, LK Tatsu, HP Shoryu FADC Red Fireball...'cause i know the last part is possible on grounded opponents (akuma b&b). also, the teleport really is awful, it goes nowhere...and e.ryu doesn't have air demon, only oni.
i did forget about one thing, it should be interesting to see what will be possible with oni's ultra fireball variations (aerial, anti-aerial).
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 2:30 am
by Doopliss
I know I will finish a combo with SRK FADC Air U1 in my first AE CMV, even if I have to do it on Dhalsims j.LP.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:02 am
by onReload
haha yeah, i need to find the input for the upward one, so I can do Shoryu FADC upward ultra, and see if it all hits...it would be weird to have one hit of the ultra go through, and the dummy falls on you or something
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:07 am
by error1
I thought it was just qcfx2 kkk for the up hadou
as for e ryu I was thinking more along the lines of
lk tatsu vs a jumping limb, j.mp ( 1 hit ), lp srk, red fireball, ultra
I suspect he can do that without using any meter
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 3:14 am
by Doopliss
it annoys me how they both had RD as super though. I wanted Shinku tatsumaki D:
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 5:21 am
by onReload
^ Yeah, i wanted something else, but ex tatsu is already shinkuu tatsumaki, technically...ryu is kinda outta supers in sf4
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 5:31 am
by error1
sfa2 evil ryu had demon, hadou, tatsu, and shoryu supers. They probley gave him demon for balancing reason, same reason Akuma can't get a good ultra.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:06 am
by onReload
i meant all his supers are in the agme, like, Gouken has Shin-Shoryuken and Denjin Hadouken; Ryu has Shinkuu Tatsumaki, Shinkuu Hadouken, Metsu Hadouken, and Metsu Shoryuken...all that would be left would be air fireball super or turning into ken and akuma (mvc1). so it would have to be a new thing
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 8:29 am
by error1
Ryu had a boxing glove super in pocket fighter, they could bring that back. E. Ryu also had a lv3 beam super in motm, and don't get me started on sftmtg
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Sat Jan 29, 2011 9:55 am
by Doopliss
error1 wrote:and don't get me started on sftmtg
They should've given E.Ryu SHORUUKEN, TATSUMAKI KINAPPOO and HADUUKEN!
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 4:25 pm
by Doopliss
Btw, anyone knows if Elf's RSF is an infinite or a loop? Iirc, you can't do it forever even if you do it perfectly, or is that wrong?
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 5:31 pm
by Rufus
Doopliss wrote:Btw, anyone knows if Elf's RSF is an infinite or a loop? Iirc, you can't do it forever even if you do it perfectly, or is that wrong?
In SF4 and SSF4, it's a loop. Every iteration, even if perfectly executed, will loose ground - the fierce punch does more knockback than the run will recover. Though it is infinite in practice mode with infinite meter and EX run. (That's one of the original test patterns I used.) The alternative run stop loops with cr. mk loose ground more quickly.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 5:33 pm
by Doopliss
Ok, thanks for the answer.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:43 pm
by Pokey86
Rufus wrote:Doopliss wrote:Btw, anyone knows if Elf's RSF is an infinite or a loop? Iirc, you can't do it forever even if you do it perfectly, or is that wrong?
In SF4 and SSF4, it's a loop. Every iteration, even if perfectly executed, will loose ground - the fierce punch does more knockback than the run will recover. Though it is infinite in practice mode with infinite meter and EX run. (That's one of the original test patterns I used.) The alternative run stop loops with cr. mk loose ground more quickly.
Does that mean as a non-infinite can you do a couple of reps as standard run then cover lost ground with EX run & repeat 4 times over? for mximum amount of reps?
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:56 pm
by Rufus
Pokey86 wrote:Rufus wrote:Doopliss wrote:Btw, anyone knows if Elf's RSF is an infinite or a loop? Iirc, you can't do it forever even if you do it perfectly, or is that wrong?
In SF4 and SSF4, it's a loop. Every iteration, even if perfectly executed, will loose ground - the fierce punch does more knockback than the run will recover. Though it is infinite in practice mode with infinite meter and EX run. (That's one of the original test patterns I used.) The alternative run stop loops with cr. mk loose ground more quickly.
Does that mean as a non-infinite can you do a couple of reps as standard run then cover lost ground with EX run & repeat 4 times over? for mximum amount of reps?
EX RSF breaks even.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMxTAT7UXJA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26Gmz4bUC6Y
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 12:24 am
by Maj
Wow, nice. What made you choose Juri as the dummy?
So 1195 damage for 99 hits, at 7 damage per hit with minimum scaling. That means you need 72 fierces to break 1000 damage? Ouch.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 12:58 am
by error1
that did 945 stun, with another ex run or a jump in or a counter hit that would dizzy right? Then you could do another 10 or so.
that seems like it would be worth doing
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:00 am
by Rufus
Maj wrote:Wow, nice. What made you choose Juri as the dummy?
She's the most Daipan friendly from a standing start.
RSF loop count with EX usage:
Code: Select all
10 Sakura
11 Hakan
12 Chun Li
12 Guy
12 Rose
14 Adon
14 Blanka
14 Cammy
14 Dhalsim
14 Dudley
14 Fei Long
14 Ken
14 Makoto
14 Rufus
14 Ryu
14 Sagat
14 Vega
15 Dan
15 Guile
15 Zangief
16 Bison
16 Cody
16 Gouken
16 Seth
16 Viper
17 Abel
17 Balrog
17 DeeJay
18 El Fuerte
18 Honda
18 Ibuki
19 Akuma
19 T Hawk
20 Juri
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:28 am
by Rufus
error1 wrote:
that did 945 stun, with another ex run or a jump in or a counter hit that would dizzy right? Then you could do another 10 or so.
that seems like it would be worth doing
The extra frames from counterhit give a free extra loop, so Juri dizzies on #15 (no EX usage), and then you can Lvl 3 focus, 19 fierces, and 3 crouching forwards the other way. Total damage would be around 777 modulo scaling. A similar combo vs Akuma would do around 719, Against T. Hawk you can run 18 fierces and 3 forwards one way, (leaving one EX bar) and probably 15 or 16 fierces plus 3 forwards after the dizzy. (Edit: Honda would probably be a better dummy for that than T Hawk.)
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:46 am
by Maj
Dang, that's an impressive amount of research. I might have to try killing Akuma in SF4 or something. Seth isn't too far behind either. Though i bet these numbers change significantly after a jump attack.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 1:47 am
by Rufus
Maj wrote:Dang, that's an impressive amount of research. I might have to try killing Akuma in SF4 or something. Seth isn't too far behind either. Though i bet these numbers change significantly after a jump attack.
RSF is better in SF4. I can test.... though I haven't unlocked Seth or Akuma in SF4 yet.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 2:39 am
by desk
@Rufus. wow, that inspired me to hit training mode and stop slacking with fuerte, lol. Don't know why but his RSF seemed much easier when I knew the theoretical maximum. Just capped this vs Juri...
j. HK, RSFx12, slide *stun* lv3FA, lv2FA, U2.
33hits.
Thanks for going to the effort to make those vids btw dude. Also, how was it better in vanilla?
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:06 am
by Rufus
desk wrote:@Rufus. wow, that inspired me to hit training mode and stop slacking with fuerte, lol. Don't know why but his RSF seemed much easier when I knew the theoretical maximum. Just capped this vs Juri...
j. HK, RSFx12, slide *stun* lv3FA, lv2FA, U2.
33hits.
Thanks for going to the effort to make those vids btw dude. Also, how was it better in vanilla?
Close fierce does base 200 stun instead of 140, so, for example, you can RSF dizzy Gief, which is effectively impossible in SSF4.... though I suppose that can also be worse.... Hmm. He didn't have the Q-Bomb FADC juggle in the corner, so... Vanilla's is probably worse.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 3:44 am
by onReload
Hmmm, I wanted to test if you could juggle after Q.Bomb in Super...so could you do my theoretical Seth-dizzy of J.HP, cl.HP xx EX Quesadilla FADC EX Guacamole? Maybe you'd need one RSF in there...you can't kill Seth with Elf either way, but you can do some huge damage.
Re: SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation
Posted: Wed Feb 09, 2011 4:09 am
by Rufus
onReload wrote:Hmmm, I wanted to test if you could juggle after Q.Bomb in Super...so could you do my theoretical Seth-dizzy of J.HP, cl.HP xx EX Quesadilla FADC EX Guacamole? Maybe you'd need one RSF in there...you can't kill Seth with Elf either way, but you can do some huge damage.
You can only FADC into LK Guacamole.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZVOrp1Gki4
Otherwise J. HP, cl HP, EX Quesadilla, FADC EX Guacamole ... U2 would be pretty close to doing Seth in.