ComboVid.com

So, El Fuerte has an infinite, eh?

Heh.

god damn it, I knew I'd seen a more suitable thread...

desk wrote:I'm sure everyone heard the infinite rumours but the vids don't show it quite yet. It's still looks pretty stupid to me

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3X0RAPgUSo

also I made a cv from the footage I got at evo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyjGQgccLNU

The jist of it is:

- El Fuerte is (was?) very low tier (bottom probably) up until this, which theoretically could knock him up the ranks some.
- [close fierce, run, stop]xN
- can be started off an FA or SA, whatever it's called (the universal chargeup that is unblockable at level 3)
- the FA can be canceled mid-way into his backwards run to avoid reversals and therefor bait->punish->infinite
- you can avoid the FA mixups with a backdash or teleport and such on wakeup
- if timed correctly it's legit blocklock (so the rumors say)
- when done with back to corner or midscreen it can be ended just outside the corner with a knockdown that gives him wonderful walldive mixups
- causes dizzy midway through but can be repeated from dizzy
- damage scaling causes it to do somewhere around half a bar or more (did like 75% to Akuma)
- other rumors are floating around that s-kill knew of this during lokes and therefor Capcom may have intentionally turned a blind eye on it

Are focus attacks safe on block if you just let them recover?
Also, how long do you need to charge before the FA causes the crumple stun? Any amount besides instant?
Are the hits of focus attacks themselves cancelable into specials/supers?

PS> I didn't read the thread, sorry >_<

NeoEmpire's SF IV System Guide will answer all your questions and instantly double your max bench press weight. Try it today!

Here's the quick digest version of all the interesting recent SF4-related news:

SF4 match video: Ino (Bison, Abel) vs Daigo (Ryu)
(Click that comment button on the bottom right to turn off all that garbage text.)

SF4 match video: Akuma/Dhalsim vs Ryu from Jungin Arcade, Korea
(Someone flipped Ryu's "Hella Rushdown Mode" switch.)

SRK thread: Ino dissects SF4
(Starts off with a link to a Japanese website, but then poonage comes through with translations.)

note that the korean vids are set to silly damage and the clock is set to run quicker too. Just in case people are put of by the ridiculous damage ryu is doing.

Also he was playing against Akuma who probably takes extra damage. More importantly, he put together an impressive streak of reading his opponent(s), because his offense was not safe whatsoever. Early on he does quite a bit of jumping and psychic DPing, without which he wouldn't have built up the meter for those EX FB corner traps. Everything basically went his way and it made Ryu look quite a bit more dangerous than he really is.

random thing I've noticed. FAC'ing costs 2 meters but when done in combo's the amount of meter actually lost is always less (because of the amount you gain during the combo). There's a standard abel string with an FAC in the middle, that only costs him about 1/2 of a sinlge bar when completed. Obviously, you must have 2 to begin with but it's interesting to know. I'll post a vid as an example if I stumble across it again.

I did an analysis of the Korean ryu match as suggested by Maj and posted it on my site. I won't link it cus it's in Dutch, but I'd like to put a small redux here.

I didn't really look or care about the unsafety (is that a word?) of his pressure strings like Maj was hammering on and on about (gawd, he just wouldnt stop)', but I took a look at how he used FA's and what implications it has/will have on how the game is played. I honestly find FA's looking more and more like parries. The Ryu players used it in 3 notable ways (that I could tell/remember):
1) in between normals to keep te pressure up or combo on hit.
2) once as a cancel to make a random DP safe
3) as a guessing game on wake-up (okizeme)

BTW, I still see a the non-unblockable (aka blockable) version of the FA causing enough stun to combo off of after a dash cancel. So I don't know if that's crumple stun or just long-ass normal stun. Anyone know?

1) In between normals makes it work much like parries. In 3S you see a lot of situations like
Ken: strong>fierce "oh, you blocked?" low parry, c.mk x mp.DP xx SA3 "lol, baited"
Only lv1 FA's probably is not comboable off of, a lv2 seems is. Either way, c.MK x EX Hadouken > FA is very similar to the 3S scenario.
DP'ing after a blocked FA will be an easy way to get out of the pressure string (probably not necessary to be that risky), you can probably wait to see if they dash forward or back to finish/cancel your dp/super/etc. Another possiblity is to use your very own FA to stop the followup.
2) Canceling DP's is very meter expensive, but so is a Roman Cancel in GG, and still you see people use it in clutch situations cus it's a "safe" guess.
3) WTF @ all those connected FA's. Only having those matches as references makes me think that Ryu player made his opponents so afraid of the unblockable lv3 FA that they wake up mashing, either that or they were just impatient. He also did FA backdash cancel which looked like a trick to bait DP's/supers/random tatsu's.

On that last topic: in 3S you can do a slow C.MK x DP with a shoto and have it ONLY cancel to DP if your opponent parries the first hit. This type of parry countering doesn't seem as possible with FA's because there is not meaningful freeze as far as I can tell. On the other hand there IS the whole long FA charge animation that you can react to. The Ryu player did that TOO. (I'm pretty impressed at the level the game's reached ' already' ) The Akuma did FA and absorbed the Ryu's j.HK. The Ryu proceeded to DP the FA. I predict people that get good at countering FA's like this will eventually be facing people that will backdash cancel after absorbing something to make your punishment whiff.

All this brings up two questions for me.
One: is there ANY opponent freeze when absorbing an attack and if so does it vary depending on your charge/FA level. (in any case, a lv1 was not enough to punish an absorbed c.MP (see 0:36 of the video)
Two: is there extra hit-stun on counter-hit?

This is mostly in regards to the Korean vid and ZenFire's post.

First of all, I'd like to take the credit for doing jump in RH (absorbed by focus attack) -> land and DP on day 1 of SF4 in Korea. Gimme my cookie now. As you guessed, I've also started doing back dash after absorbing a jumping attack against people with DPs. However, you should know that some DPs travel horizontally a lot, and the back dash will get caught towards the end to these DPs.

That Ryu player in the vid is the best SF4 player in Korea atm, because that fool went to SBO and didn't play anything but SF4 while everyone else was just sucking their thumbs waiting for the official release in Korea (it was released like 3-4 weeks ago here). He gets a lot of damage through focus attacks. Like Zenfire said, he uses them like parries as well as wake up meaty mixups. It doesn't happen in the vids, but lately he's been doing meaty unblockable focus attacks on people's wake up. You either gotta do a reversal DP type move or reversal back dash out of it. It hurts like hell when you miss your reversal here. He has a good focus attack game, poking game and mixups. The rest of his game is completed by the fact that Ryu has really good combo options and he just knows how to rush that shit down.

There is a slight freeze to both characters when a hit is absorbed by a focus attack, but it happens to both characters, so it's not like parries.

There is extra hit stun on counter hits. On a related note, the hit stun is the same whether the opponent was crouching or standing like cvs2.

One thing I really don't like about Ultras is that the game's clock won't stop during the flash. This is really shitty when you are chasing a Ryu with more life with little time left on the clock, cuz his Ultra freeze animation takes 300 years to finish and the time keeps ticking while he's getting that shit ready. It's only Ryu that has really long Ultra freeze animation, so it's really unfair too. They should make the clock stop during freeze animations.

Another weird thing about super freezes and ultra freezes is that they don't stop the time. They only slow the time. So during a super freeze, it goes through about 1 or 2 frames, and ultras seem to go through 2 or 3. The amount of frames gone by seems less during a super freeze than ultras for sure.

*hands over whole cookie jar*

Oh man, great post Laugh, I have so many questions now!

Where to begin...
Ok, so the meaty (or really soon after getting up, cus I think an ACTUAL meaty is a little hard to pull off consistently) unblockables. If you have enough time to backdash out of it does that mean backdashes are just THAT fast or have really good evasive properties? Don't quick getups run the whole thing? what knockdowns does he do it after?

On a related note, the system info on neoempire said that Lv3 FA's become invincible at some point, but you can still DP them out of the very last part of it according to what you said. So it's only invincible to normals or something?

I'm guessing 'no', but can you absorb a lv3 FA with your own FA? That would be too easy of a way out, that's why I'm guessing people must have tried it by now and learned that it doesn't work XD

The clock not being stopped really seems like an oversight on the designers' part. How are you able to tell that the opponent isn't completely frozen during the super or ultra freeze? Can you see them still dropping slowly in juggle situations?

From what I've seen most ultras have a negligable startup after the freeze, dare I say 'instant'. Is it cus the slowdown extends beyond the actual freeze (screen turns dark)? Can you whiff punish with them?

I really want to play this game. There's no hope of getting the arcade version here and the cabinets are so ridiculously expensive that I totally understand why..

Backdashes have some invincibility on startup, like GG.

Ive seen this on a AUS forum. Someone might find it interesting, but not sure if you know about it or not.

http://www.ozhadou.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3320

Oh wow, I certainly didn't know that. It'll be interesting to see the practicality of this.
Btw, the blog that the post links to has a naked woman in the background... nsfw
well, I could hardly tell, and I might be wrong, but I think I saw a nipple...

Most ultas can't whiff punish, they don't hit far enough fast enough.

Notable exception would be Abel's..... which is probably the best/fastest ultra in the game, it can punish people for backdashing on wakeup if you guess right, not quite fast enough to react, but if they backdash you ultra, you will hit, at least thats what Ino was saying.

Chun-lis may also be able to do this and maybe ultra raging demon... though the fast part of the start up for ultra raging demon is pretty short range.

Lvl3 FAs are Armor breakers *break FA armor or armor from ex specials* so no reversal FA

reversal DPs (maybe all reversal hitting specials IE not fireballs) gain an extra property of being armor break attacks, or at least so says nonoho from srk. Who is usually well informed. It must be a reversal you do after being knocked down as far as I know, so if you tech roll for instance you would lose the chance to do this.

Sadly the fact that you do infact move a bit during startup freeze makes it even harder to use ultras as reversals for things. I tried to block shoto sweep reversal ultra with abel and it was a no go.

From the Fighting Game News thread ...

fullmetalross wrote:Viper as people would probably guess is a combo monster. Crazy combos that take some execution. She can totally do shit no one else gets to thanks to super jump and feints its pretty awesome.

By stuff I mean things like she has a special you can super jump cancel... because that you can cancel that special into saving attack for free... pretty nifty.

Wow, that is pretty sweet actually. Does Chun Li have any jump cancelable attacks in SF4, or does her kick super go through a canned animation now?

Canned animation again ssf2 style. She actually has funny juggles though. LIke air to air hpx2, land, rejump d.mkx3 I do not believe her close rh is cancelable into jump anymore either.

Also she has a kick chain that is b+mk,mk,d,u+mk basically she does like a kick into her mvc launcher and then does the upkicks. But you can FADC *focus attack dash cancel* the launcher kick and follow up with a juggle combo such as the d.mkx3!

Yeah Viper is awesome, totally a combo'ers dream. Here is my list of combos thread *warning not much is explained as its just a list but I'll be happy to explain anything*

http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=164908

ZenFire wrote:Oh wow, I certainly didn't know that. It'll be interesting to see the practicality of this.
Btw, the blog that the post links to has a naked woman in the background... nsfw
well, I could hardly tell, and I might be wrong, but I think I saw a nipple...

Yeah sorry, i never checked the site, i just saw the info and thought you guys might like it.

yes, you can super cancel or ultra after taking one hit from FC. I discovered this weeks ago. Along with a lot of other shit that nobody in japan is even doing. But sorry, for elite ears only. Id prob be more inclined to help out our community if they were filled with a bunch of japan fan boy, youtube watchers. To me it just seems like everyone is just waiting for the next jap vid to find out waht to do in this game.

What happen to figuring stuff out on our own. Anyway, there is so much shit u can do with FC its not even funny =D Guess peeps are gonna have to wait for the first Seattle Tourney to see the fire im unleashing =P

But just know...that stuff works.

Cole

lol most of the stuff i figured out, I figured out after one day with the game and breakin down the system. Theroyfighted in my head for weeks and weeks. Played, tested, confirmed (blew my own mind).

Guess im being an ass. Continue to watch youtube, you guys can shit bricks when you see the vids

Cole


ps- its not like u cant refuse to challenge and pick trainign mode and sit there and practice =) so what if people yell at u for not challenging. That, or learn and test while playing...its hard but it makes u better in the long run. I had to do it, valle did it...many others did it.

For those of u who have no access, sorry, continue to watch youtube.

aside from being incredibly frustrated by these posts, ergh!!! has anyone else heard anything about this?

... Goryus?

Well, I voiced my opinion in that thread.

Cole is silly... he thinks shit he finds is mind blowing or something, but in the Northwest forums he was talking about shit he discovered, and he's still behind the times....

in my opinion I highly doubt a connected saving attack can be directly canceled into ultra. Also the chances of being able to cancel out of the dash startup into an ultra also seems unlikely as that is a type of cancel that I don't think has ever occured in street fighter and from what I can tell about 4 they are using what could be described as the basic street fighter engine for things such as cancelability. I don't really see how this could be the case.... but who knows, maybe capcom fudged something up.

fullmetalross wrote: I highly doubt a connected saving attack can be directly canceled into ultra.

I don't know what thread you guys are referring to, but reading Desk's quotes I interpreted as being that you coul cancel into super the instant you absorb/take a hit while charging.

well the original thread starter the way he typed it sounded something closer to what I originally posted. Now people have clarified a bit and its more like what desk said. Which seems much more feasible to me, though still not wholey believable....

To: maj
From: Ross

GUILE COMBOS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htFcE1Brop4

Yeah, I was just about to post the link to that Guile video I made. This was done really quick (under an hour) to show the people on SRK the combo potential with Guile. I plan on making a high quality combo video in the next few months. Probably around January. I was discussing some stuff with Edma last night and I think he has a 100% stun combo. He's got that japanese SF4 mook and was able to give me data concerning the combo. I've already ordered the book and it should be here in a few days.

I have a couple of questions about this clip: guile super to ultra 3

1) Sonic Boom to super only costs 3 pills?
2) Are there any hidden juggle rules or does ultra always juggle as long as Guile's within range?
3) How come you didn't do this combo in the corner? Wouldn't you get more hits out of the ultra?

gilley wrote:Yeah, I was just about to post the link to that Guile video I made. This was done really quick (under an hour) to show the people on SRK the combo potential with Guile. I plan on making a high quality combo video in the next few months. Probably around January. I was discussing some stuff with Edma last night and I think he has a 100% stun combo. He's got that japanese SF4 mook and was able to give me data concerning the combo. I've already ordered the book and it should be here in a few days.

just remember that stun damage scales, but I don't know if the formula is according to damage scaling or not.

Maj wrote:I have a couple of questions about this clip: guile super to ultra 3

1) Sonic Boom to super only costs 3 pills?
2) Are there any hidden juggle rules or does ultra always juggle as long as Guile's within range?
3) How come you didn't do this combo in the corner? Wouldn't you get more hits out of the ultra?

1)nope, it's using up 4 in that video
2)I don't quite understand the juggle rules for his ultra yet. I've had it hit randomly lots of times. One time gief jumped in at me with a d+fierce and I used my ultra really deep and only got 3 hits out of the ultra, one hit on every FK. I've had the first 2 FK's hit and the 3rd wiff(doesn't even come out). I've also had the first FK wiff, the 2nd hit(one hit), then the 3rd wiff(doesn't even come out).
3)I was just showing that it's possible to link the super to the ultra from anywhere, not just the corner.

http://gilley3d.blogspot.com/

So I've started an online notebook/blog about some of the things I find in SF4. Alot of this stuff is going to be for Guile. I'm just doing this to make sure I don't forget about anything when I start doing this new Guile combo video. It might also get me to come up with other ideas for cool combos. I'll probably be updating it pretty regularly until sometime after the holidays. I plan on starting to record my video sometime during the xmas break. You might find some of the stuff on this blog interesting. I've also updated the SRK SF4 Wiki with all the frame data for every character in the game. That's helping me find out any possible combos with Guile.