SFxT Combo Engine Investigation

[Snoooootch]

I have actually been looking at exactly that, Rufus. Like, a mid combo counter hit, but I still haven't found anything that breaks the current NORMAL norms of juggling.

[Rufus]

I have actually been looking at exactly that, Rufus. Like, a mid combo counter hit, but I still haven't found anything that breaks the current NORMAL norms of juggling.

Assuming you can get the counterhit properties, there might be something in:
Counterhit final TAP (against airbore) -> EX Dash (whatever it is) xx foward dash -> Counterhit final TAP
Which, assuming a 20% counterhit damage bonus would be exactly 1200 damage. (Would that do Hugo in, or just leave him at 0 life?)

On the downside, each attempt would take a minute to set up.

[Doopliss]

I have actually been looking at exactly that, Rufus. Like, a mid combo counter hit, but I still haven't found anything that breaks the current NORMAL norms of juggling.

Assuming you can get the counterhit properties, there might be something in:
Counterhit final TAP (against airbore) -> EX Dash (whatever it is) xx foward dash -> Counterhit final TAP
Which, assuming a 20% counterhit damage bonus would be exactly 1200 damage. (Would that do Hugo in, or just leave him at 0 life?)

On the downside, each attempt would take a minute to set up.

CH bonus is 25%. I've played around with this, and I don't think you're able to land two final TAPs like that, maybe with your back to the wall. You definitely don't have time for a dash though, unless you trade.

And Hugo has 1150 HP, not 1200. Even if he did have 1200 (which would leave him with 1 HP if the combo did 1200), you could jsut hit him with a s.MP or something after the 2nd wallbounce to kill him.

[Snoooootch]

Well, with trade, it should work as 2 final taps, then tag in the team mate, then do a cr. mk to super, or something...........

[Snoooootch]

By the way, here's 5 clips I have so far for tomorrow's combo video with Rolento/Yoshi. The last clip is when you negate the animation. There is NOTHING you can do to the opponent after Yoshi cuts him/her. So that was the best I could think of. Any other ideas?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYORb5XwdTk

[Rufus]

With Yoshi
Can you dash cancel the EX sword spin more quickly than the regular one?
Can you switch cancel any of the self-knockdown moves like the Suicide?

No combos with Rolento's Knife?

Is it possible to switch cancel teleport or trick landing?

[Snoooootch]

Oh, well, I still haven't explored much of that. I'm going Special by special, finding different things within them. I know with the suicide, he can tag in a partner and combo from that, but idk. I'm gonna look into it tonight.

[Rufus]

Sorry, I guess I misunderstood.

Does the character retain the counter-hit property on hard tag?

[Snoooootch]

Well, I was only able to combo into his air knife throw once. Idk how else to combo into it, but I do have some more ideas for a Part 2 combo video

[Doopliss]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dGRUJ_x1oQ



No but seriously, wtf Capcom?

[Pokey86]

SFXT juggle is confusing.

- Akumas SRK leaves them at JP1, i'm guessing

- Cammys Crouch HP is JP3, perhaps thats universal to fierce moves i don't know.

- Cammy's Spin knuckle causes float, or something similair.

- Canon Spike is JP4

However

- After Akumas HP SRK you can do 3 Crouch Fierce in to Canon Spike

- Logically, that means, after spin knuckle, you should be able to do 4 Crouch HP in to Canon Spike, but you can't, Canon Spike wiffs, but this should mean that Crouch HP shouldn't've hit a 4th time.

I have no answer for this enigma.

Also Switching obvously resets the juggle count in someway, but not completely.

[Snoooootch]

So does Balrog still have a slower fall speed in SFxT, or was it reset from sf4?

[Pokey86]

It's not that he fell slower ,it's just that he raises higher when he was hit airborne.

& i have no idea.

[error1]

SFXT juggle is confusing.

- Akumas SRK leaves them at JP1, i'm guessing

each hit increases it by one
lp srk is jp=1 JuggleIncrement=1 JuggleIncrementLimit+=1
mp is jp=1,2 JuggleIncrement=1,2 JuggleIncrementLimit+=1,1
hp is jp=2,3,4 JuggleIncrement=1,1,4 JuggleIncrementLimit+=1,1,1
ex is jp=4,5,6 JuggleIncrement=1,1,6 JuggleIncrementLimit+=1,1,1

- Cammys Crouch HP is JP3, perhaps thats universal to fierce moves i don't know.

cammy's 2hp is jp3, that's normal for a hard attack, but not universal

- Cammy's Spin knuckle causes float, or something similair.

yeah all versions are
jp=3,3 JuggleIncrement=0,3 JuggleIncrementLimit+=0,1

- Canon Spike is JP4

all versions are jp3

However

- After Akumas HP SRK you can do 3 Crouch Fierce in to Canon Spike

- Logically, that means, after spin knuckle, you should be able to do 4 Crouch HP in to Canon Spike, but you can't, Canon Spike wiffs, but this should mean that Crouch HP shouldn't've hit a 4th time.

I have no answer for this enigma.

Also Switching obvously resets the juggle count in someway, but not completely.

seems like this is beacuse only the first hitbox on spin knuckle causes float

[Maj]

Someone on twitter was asking me about the input window for Kazuya's EWGF in SFxT. Before i go through the trouble of testing it, does anyone happen to know what it is?

[error1]

you can find that info here http://pandora.dantarion.com/dumps/ if you know how to read it

the guide doesn't mention any move by that name, isn't that just his Rising Uppercut?

[error1]

nevermind I found it. It's called SAI_HU in the game files. Interestingly there is a SAI_RAI too.
Strangely there isn't a special cancel list for it like I expected. It doesn't look like you are canceling miststep, it's just it's own move. if you do f,n,d, then df+mp,hp you get SAI_HU, otherwise df gets you mist step. So depending on if you can kara cancel it or not it's a 1-2 frame window.
As a note it looks like you can mist step and then cancel into SAI_HU, in the same way you can cancel mist step into its self.

seems like you might have a much larger window if you cancel it from a normal or as a reversal. I think that so long as you input it during the move buffer it should come out over miststep

[Doopliss]

I dunno, I've lost all motivation witht he release of this game. I've had a Hugo CMV just lying there since last monday, all I need to do is to put it all together, but I'm just not feeling it.

[Maj]

Kazuya has always had two versions of that uppercut move - regular Wind Godfist and Electric Wind Godfist:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XNuYLw_NJVw

Unfortunately the command for EWGF is mysterious as fuck. You have to perform WGF "perfectly" in order to get EWGF. I guess the question is, what's the exact input for EWGF and how lenient is it? Also you can definitely cancel Mist Step into WGF at any point.

[error1]

ok yeah that's easy, the move uses this input

Code: Select all

SAI_HU_STEP
Super Easy
Buffer	Input	Flags
8	DOWN	LENIENT_DIRECTION	0	0
Easy
Buffer	Input	Flags
8	FORWARD	LENIENT_DIRECTION	0	0
8	NEUTRAL	STRICT_DIRECTION	0	0
Normal
Buffer	Input	Flags
8	FORWARD	STRICT_DIRECTION	0	0
8	NEUTRAL	STRICT_DIRECTION	0	0
8	DOWN	LENIENT_DIRECTION	0	0
Strict
Buffer	Input	Flags
8	FORWARD	STRICT_DIRECTION	0	0
8	NEUTRAL	STRICT_DIRECTION	15	1
8	DOWN	STRICT_DIRECTION	0	0

then you press

Code: Select all

HP MP DOWN FORWARD 	STRICT_DIRECTION +ON_PRESS BUTTONS0x100 

so using the normal input you have
pure forward, neutral within 8 frames, any down direction within 8 frames, down+forward+mp,hp within 8 frames, can't negative edge

[onReload]

It's that you have to press punch (according to the above, I guess MP or HP) at the same time you hit df. Probably can't go to f

[error1]

you should be able to go to f, you just can't go to df without pressing a punch button or you get mist step.

[Maj]

Cool, thanks. On second thought, i would feel bad taking credit for any of this. Would you mind answering this dude directly instead?

[Rufus]

Now that I've picked up a copy of the game, It seems like pandora mode is a relatively unexplored thing - even in terms of practical combos.

On that topic, does anyone know whether you can charge TAP while off-screen in two player mode? It seems like there should be a relatively practical cross assault combo that lands final TAP as hits 2 and 4 and would OHKO much of the cast.

[error1]

it causes wall bounce now so can't you just turn punch trade vs air (wall bounce), turn punch

[Snoooootch]

Fancy combos are hard! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Qzce0xjS4E

But the game is awesome, Rufus. Can't wait to see what you can get.

Of, and for my combo, you can combo cr. mk before the srks that Ken does after the st. hk Special Attack Dash Cancel, but that was just way too hard. I spent way too long recording it. 90 minutes was the third time I tried landing it. Oh, and in order for law to go under Hugo like that in the middle of the combo, you have to tag in on Ken's secon hit of his hp srk so you tag in closer. If you wait till the third hit, it's still possible, but the timing is a lot harder.

Oh, but if you do a st. mk, that kick goes way up, and makes the combo a lot easier, but I didn't think about it till this morning when playing again.

[Rufus]

it causes wall bounce now so can't you just turn punch trade vs air (wall bounce), turn punch

I meant as a practical hit confirm. I'm not sure these are possible, and not really combovid.com material, but these look semi-practical:

P1: Jump-in, Cross Assault, Launcher , P2: Releasess: TAP Final (wall bounce), TAP Final (wall bounce), P1 charge-up super.
If that's possible, it should knock out most of the cast.
or
P1: Jump-in, Wall Bounce EX (Start Pandora) -> P2: TAP x2, Balrog Super.

[Snoooootch]

My friend Arthur sent me this. Not sure what to do with it, but maybe you guys can find something out of it?

Been messing with a bunch of stuff thought you might like this. You can take a jump cancelable move and do like, 2, 2, 8, strong+forward and cancel into pandora. There's a bunch of pushback if you do it on the ground, but if you do it anti air whatever combo should work.

I'm playing Juri/Hugo atm and have a couple of practical combos, whatever into forward pinwheel in a corner, then juggle into crouch fierce xx pandora, then ex clap until I run out of meter, ~771 dmg I think is the highest I got without gems. Also as a big punish, just a simple crouch fierce xx pandora into super does (with the stupid gem I had equipped while figuring shit out cuz I'm dumb) 650 dmg, ~520 or so without gems? dunno and not really able to test atm. Whatever, maybe you can find something cool with somebody using this.

[Maj]

Would any of you guys be interested in writing an SFxT Juggle System Overview for ComboVid? I'm not looking for anything super crazy detailed, but just a self-contained explanation of the basic rules. I think it would be a cool article to post, especially if someone could read it and understand the core engine without having to refer to that crazy complicated debug database that we keep referring to.

Maybe a few of you guys could work together on it? Feel free to use this thread as scratch paper for collaborating on the first draft.

I'd do it myself but um ... i don't actually know how to SFxT works. (That's kind of what made me want this article to exist.)

[Snoooootch]

Well, Pokey did an awesome job with the first one. All I know so far is that the Juggle counter is reset when you tag in, and it affects both characters.

For instance, when I do a ground bounce with Law, then follow it with a repeated ground bounce, that makes 2 medium punches, The only follow up is a cr. hp, and you can cancel it into a triple spin kick. The kick hits 3 times on a regular basis, but in this scenario, it only juggles twice. This is always the case. Just like a juggle with st. hk, special attack dash cancel, to cr. mk, to hp shoryuken. Only 2 of Ken's hit.

BUT, in both cases, if you tag the team mate in, both the triple spin kick AND the hp srk hit all 3 times.

Now, out of that, I don't know if that added juggle hit takes away from the following juggle by the other team mate, but I do believe it does remove juggle potential. When in the scenario of Ken's hp srk juggling 3 hits BECAUSE of the tag in, I am able to juggle the opponent with Law's ground bounce for a total of 3 hits, That's a 2 hit target combo that doesn't do the ground bounce hit on the second target combo.

It makes perfect sense when you try it. And as I write this, it does as well.