SF4 Combo Engine Investigation

[Maj]

Worst thing about SRK is having to make video threads in that Video Gallery hellhole and hoping some mod will be nice enough to Rise From Your Grave it into a forum people actually visit. It's like its own dumb little minigame ... Combo Maker Forum RPG.

[error1]

I noticed, it wouldn't let me create a topic in the sf4 area. I almost did it in the ken subthread, and probably should have.

Well thanks for posting it on CX, HVO, and NeoGAF whatever those acronyms stand for, was wondering why the view count was in the three digits despite not posting it anywhere.

[Raine]

Wow, awesome vid error1! I totally wasn't expecting that to happen.

[laugh]

Hey guys, it's been many seasons since my last post and visit here, but I have a ton of SF4 findings and system details I wanna discuss with you guys.

I'm primarily a competitive player before I am a combo maker, but during my quest to get an edge over my opponents with my main character Ryu, I've run into some interesting details that I have yet to explain.

#1 Pre-jump frame properties
-When you get into pre-jump animation in games likes cvs2 and 3s, I believe you're immediately throw-invincible from frame 1 of the pre-jump. That's why empty jump into rejump will get you out of throw attempts almost every time in those games. However, I've found that to be untrue in SF4. Empty jump into another jump will still get my character grabbed by the opponent's regular throw.

#2 Landing frames, and specials
-With Ryu, if you knock the other character with cr.rh and hold up+forward, it will give you the perfect safe jump timing, which means the last frame of the jumping attack will overlap with the first frame of the other character after it gets up. BTW, because you need a minimum of 1 frame of attack frame during your jump and 2 landing recovery frames, safe jumps do not work against 3 frame uppercut characters like Ryu/Ken/Akuma because they will hit you during your recovery frame. Also Sagat, Blanka, Cammy, and Gen get up later then the rest of the cast so this canned setup doesn't work.

So I started testing some option selects using this setup, and came to find some interesting findings.

The option select I'm referring to goes like this. If the opponent does an invincible move as reversal, my jumping attack does not cause hit-stop, so inputing a DP right after the jumping attack will let me beat their invincible move. If they don't do any invincible moves, the DP doesn't come out because I'm still in the middle of the hits-top.

So take Guile, the fastest invincible move he has is the flash kick, which is 4 frames. So I went to practice mode and I was able to block the flash kick every time after landing from my jumping attack. However, when I tried option selecting with DP, it will NOT come out against reversal flash kick. No matter how times I tried, I wasn't able to DP. It didn't make sense that I can block on the first frame after the landing recovery but can't do any special moves. So i thought maybe this was a weird minor glitch for the first frame after the landing recovery, but I was wrong.

I naturally thought the safest option select to do against Abel was a jump after the jumping attack, but because the prejump frames are vulnerable to throws like I mentioned earlier, reversal EX tornado throw beats this option. So I looked up the frame data, and the EX tornado throw is a 5 frame move, which is 1 frame slower than flash kick. So I thought I might be able to use DP as the option select to beat the EX tornado throw cuz I had 1 more frame before the reversal move came out, but I STILL wasn't able to get a DP out no matter how many times I tried. Which means I can't do any specials even on the second frame after the landing recovery.

#3 Super freeze and specials
-This may or may not be related to the landing recovery frames and inability to do specials, but when you do Chun's super next to the opponent, the only thing the opponent can do after the flash is to block or get hit. There's 1 frame of start up during flash and 1 frame after the flash, but if you want to beat the super, you have to do a move before the flash. You just can't get any DPs/flash kicks or supers/ultras after the flash, but you can block.

#4 Frame data notation in SF4
-For every move in the game, the startup number they give you includes the first frame of the active attack frame, but they seem to give you the traditional startup numbers only for the super (Zangief's super has 0 post-flash frames while Chun has 1).



Anybody have any better understanding of why these are happening the way they do?

[error1]

Good stuff
I have some understanding of superfreeze, in that the game won't recognize inputs during it even if your character is moving. But you should still be able to start a flash kick because it only requires 1 frame of input.

I'm guessing you're not using a program pad to test this, is there anything you'd like me to check with a script.

[Xenozip.]

Anybody have any better understanding of why these are happening the way they do?

#1 - Well empty jump into rejump is kind of a faulty test because it could be the landing recovery that is vulnerable, as with most games (except Jojo's, lol). The only way to be sure would be to record a perfect tick throw setup and watch it in slow motion (frame by frame).

It wouldn't surprise me though, honestly. Capcom/Ono did a lot of unusual things with SF4, like giving backdashes invulnerability frames which isn't in any Capcom fighter ever (cept SF4).

#2 - Weird. Daigo's been using the DP option select since forever ago.
(Daigo) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSBtGHRFhkI#t=52s
(MagnetoManiac) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvdNDXX-JCU
(DandyJ) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nL2zpySSymE

But I don't know why it's behaving this way for you. There's a discussion thread on SRK about this here: http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=207625

Incidentally the Shoto's can also c.MK under Rufus' EX Messiah as shown here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUxm5IO1rgk

Because shoto c.MK pancakes down so low. It also goes under Tiger Knees and some jump-ins.

#3 - That's odd. I was under the impression you can buffer moves during flash. If you can, but can only block, that's quite a peculiar find.

#4 - Yeah there was a discussion about the notation here a while back. But, I had no idea they used different notation for supers, lol.

[laugh]

Good stuff
I have some understanding of superfreeze, in that the game won't recognize inputs during it even if your character is moving. But you should still be able to start a flash kick because it only requires 1 frame of input.

I'm guessing you're not using a program pad to test this, is there anything you'd like me to check with a script.

You would be right if we weren't talking about SF4, but SF4 allows input from the opponent during the entire super freeze and ultra freeze. It's VERY easy to do moves right after super freeze and ultra freeze in SF4.

Anybody have any better understanding of why these are happening the way they do?

#1 - Well empty jump into rejump is kind of a faulty test because it could be the landing recovery that is vulnerable, as with most games (except Jojo's, lol). The only way to be sure would be to record a perfect tick throw setup and watch it in slow motion (frame by frame).

It wouldn't surprise me though, honestly. Capcom/Ono did a lot of unusual things with SF4, like giving backdashes invulnerability frames which isn't in any Capcom fighter ever (cept SF4).

#2 - Weird. Daigo's been using the DP option select since forever ago.
(Daigo) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSBtGHRFhkI#t=52s
(MagnetoManiac) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvdNDXX-JCU
(DandyJ) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nL2zpySSymE

But I don't know why it's behaving this way for you. There's a discussion thread on SRK about this here: http://forums.shoryuken.com/showthread.php?t=207625

Incidentally the Shoto's can also c.MK under Rufus' EX Messiah as shown here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uUxm5IO1rgk

Because shoto c.MK pancakes down so low. It also goes under Tiger Knees and some jump-ins.

#3 - That's odd. I was under the impression you can buffer moves during flash. If you can, but can only block, that's quite a peculiar find.

#4 - Yeah there was a discussion about the notation here a while back. But, I had no idea they used different notation for supers, lol.

That isn't against Guile's flash kick or Abel's EX tornado throw. The move being countered in those clips is EX messiah kick, which is a 11 frame move. It's super easy to counter that move with the option select, and other moves like Honda's EX headbutt, Viper's various invincible moves are all moves that I counter on everyday basis using the option select.

A tick throw test may not be the best test, because the situation I feel this the most is when I try to rejump and the situation in rejumping might be different from a tick throw setup. SF4 clearly doesn't let me rejump out of throws when I definitely do them consistently in other games like cvs2 and 3s.

Alright, I've done some more testing and I might be onto something regarding landing frames.

Here's another example for you to contemplate about. Ryu sweeps Abel with cr.rh, jump forward immediately, and hold up on the joystick without pressing anything mid-air and Abel does reversal EX tornado throw. That is clearly an empty jump into rejump setup where Abel's reversal frame overlaps with the last frame of Ryu's jump, and Ryu gets grabbed 100% in all of my tests. Since I inputted the up direction as fast as possible by holding up, and an empty jump doesn't force you into landing invulnerability frames, it would seem like you should be able to start your jump immediately and get out of the throw but you clearly can't because Abel grabs you even though it's a whopping 5 frame throw.

However, Ryu's RH hurricane kick is -2 frames on block, but you can get out of 3 frame throws by holding up EVERY TIME. I made Ryu do an rh hurricane kick, made Seth block it till the last hit, then reversal SPD (3 frame throw). Ryu gets out every single time, which means pre-jump animations are throw invincible from the very first frame.

So I revise my statement earlier in #1. Pre-jump frames are throw-invincible from frame 1, but there seems to be some weird stuff going on during landing.

[Maj]

So I revise my statement earlier in #1. Pre-jump frames are throw-invincible from frame 1, but there seems to be some weird stuff going on during landing.

I'm a little confused about how this makes SF4 special. In CvS2 Training Mode, you can set the opponent action to Jump and you can still throw them even with a normal throw.

So take Guile, the fastest invincible move he has is the flash kick, which is 4 frames. So I went to practice mode and I was able to block the flash kick every time after landing from my jumping attack. However, when I tried option selecting with DP, it will NOT come out against reversal flash kick. No matter how times I tried, I wasn't able to DP. It didn't make sense that I can block on the first frame after the landing recovery but can't do any special moves.

Yeah Guile's pretty awesome.

What if you try buffering option select DP and then blocking immediately? Like F, D, DF, DB+P and hold DB.

[Xenozip.]

-snip-

Yeah I realized after posting that a tick throw setup might be a bad idea due to possibly wonky throw-invulnerability post-block/hit-stun. Though your Ryu tatsu vs Seth's spd makes that obsolete. Though again I wouldn't have been surprised because prejump isn't inv in Jojos (though oddly, jump landing is).

Have you conducted the same Abel test with Ryu whiffing an attack in the air? Or conducted the Seth test with Viper's Super Jump?

I'm a little curious now so I might try them out too in a minute. I'm also curious if there's a way to test this where Ryu's attack is blocked or hits, but that'd be a tough one to test due to jumpins not have any solid frame data.

What if you try buffering option select DP and then blocking immediately? Like F, D, DF, DB+P and hold DB.

Or RDP with Fei's EX upkick?

[laugh]

So I revise my statement earlier in #1. Pre-jump frames are throw-invincible from frame 1, but there seems to be some weird stuff going on during landing.

I'm a little confused about how this makes SF4 special. In CvS2 Training Mode, you can set the opponent action to Jump and you can still throw them even with a normal throw.

What if you try buffering option select DP and then blocking immediately? Like F, D, DF, DB+P and hold DB.

In cvs2, if you land rolento's patriot circle in the corner then hold up, the j.RH from the jump is a perfect safe jump on most characters. In fact, the minimum numbers required for a safe jump to work is exactly the same as SF4 which is 3, and you can option select to counter 3 frame invincible moves in cvs2 without a problem because by the time their 3 frame invincible attack can hit on the 4th frame rolento is on the first frame of his super/activation/etc.

I haven't tested that input, but I have a feeling it'll just get me hit. I tried pressing a normal while keeping the stick in DB, and that got me hit.

Yeah I realized after posting that a tick throw setup might be a bad idea due to possibly wonky throw-invulnerability post-block/hit-stun. Though your Ryu tatsu vs Seth's spd makes that obsolete. Though again I wouldn't have been surprised because prejump isn't inv in Jojos (though oddly, jump landing is).

Have you conducted the same Abel test with Ryu whiffing an attack in the air? Or conducted the Seth test with Viper's Super Jump?

I'm a little curious now so I might try them out too in a minute. I'm also curious if there's a way to test this where Ryu's attack is blocked or hits, but that'd be a tough one to test due to jumpins not have any solid frame data.

What if you try buffering option select DP and then blocking immediately? Like F, D, DF, DB+P and hold DB.

Or RDP with Fei's EX upkick?

I've definitely tested the same setup with Ryu whiffing an attack in the air as well, and it gets grabbed 100% of the time. Emptying jumping and rejumping didn't work, and adding landing recovery to it didn't help as expected.

[Maj]

I haven't tested that input, but I have a feeling it'll just get me hit. I tried pressing a normal while keeping the stick in DB, and that got me hit.

If it gets you hit then it's a big deal because it means Ryu is doing something when he lands - it's just not DP.

[Xenozip.]

Hmm right, that brings up the question of TripGuard.

So, is the landing recovery crouch cancelable? It should be. If it's not then that means tripguard doesn't exist in SF4, which is indeed major as Maj suggested.

Perhaps Laugh's setup would need to first be crouch canceled before the DP will come out? Simply doing a frame-perfect DP attempt might not put Ryu in a crouch position. Which would mean he could crouch block but not DP or stand block. Assuming he can crouch block, which he might very well not be able to as Laugh has said already (which would mean no tripguard in sf4, wow).

I know Vanguard Princess implemented a ghetto version of tripguard by making empty jumps simply invulnerable on landing to anything, but also implemented a landing recovery equal to the invulnerability duration.

And now I'm kind of curious if FuzzyGuard exists in SF4.

Guess I'll go load training mode.

[Maj]

In most Capcom fighting games you can't do a special move immediately when you land (and in certain other recovery situations). If you go frame by frame, you see your character do a normal move for one or two frames and then automatically cancel into whatever special move you attempted.

It's not a negative edge kara cancel because it happens even if you hold the button.

[Xenozip.]

OK here's some testing results:

Whether Ryu attacks or does not attack he can land and crouch block against a reversal flash kick regardless.

If Ryu does not attack he can land and DP through a reversal flash kick.

If Ryu attacks then I can't land and DP through a reversal flashkick. I'm not sure if it's impossible or not, but it's rather difficult (I can't do it).

[Xenozip.]

More testing results:

I tried what Maj suggested and input a DP into an immediate block. If Guile did a reversal flashkick Ryu would block, and if the flashkick wasn't a reversal he'd DP through it. Though that doesn't really reveal anything useful.

FuzzyGuard does exist in SF4. No surprise there. But at least we know that both tripguard and fuzzyguard are in, just like every other capcom fighter.

[Maj]

What's FuzzyGuard?

[Xenozip.]

Fuzzyguard is an inauspicious term used for while-rising overheads that only work provided the opponent was already in standing blockstun. I believe the Japanese call it Ohage or Kamone, but I don't remember honestly since I'm so use to the incorrect "fuzzyguard" usage.

Incidentally 3D fighting game players use the term fuzzyguard correctly in the sense that it has the same meaning for them as it does for Japanese players. But their definition of fuzzyguard has nothing to do with while-rising overheads, it's only the English 2D fighting community that tosses the term around incorrectly.

Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QC83KGp8ti0 <-- you get ultra super extra cookie points if you recognize the BGM.

The mechanic is simple, you can't switch to a crouching pose if you're in standing blockstun. So while Chun-Li's while-rising j.HK won't hit a crouching opponent Chun, if she does j.HK j.HK and the opponent first standblocks then crouch blocks the second j.HK will connect, despite the opponent trying to crouch guard, because their hittable box doesn't change from a stand pose despite holding downback due to still being in stand blockstun.

The technique though has somewhat limited use in traditional Street Fighter because even though it's very difficult to block it's also kind of easy to punish on reaction. With the exception of Chun-Li who gets free-action after her headstomp and therefor can at least defend herself on the way down with either an attack or walljump.

[Maj]

Oh ok, thanks. I don't know about "you can't switch to a crouching pose if you're in standing blockstun" for the entirety of blockstun, but yeah there's definitely a period when you can't switch. So you're saying if you go to DB, you get the low-blocking property while maintaining the high-blocking hitbox? What was your test for this in SF4?

[Xenozip.]

Yup, that's what I'm saying in a nutshell. Actually my test in SF4 was my example, Chun j.HK j.HK vs Chun.

The dummy recording was unable to hit with rising j.HK on a crouching Chun. But highblock into lowblock against the recording proved successful as she entered crouching hitstun after blocking high and then being hit by the rising j.HK.

In most games that it's in it lasts for the entirety of the blockstun but we don't usually take note of it because usually other moves interrupt the previous blockstun which allows us to switch block stance. For example j.HK c.LK will allow us to go into a crouch block stance because the new c.LK blockstun. Which is also why you enter crouching hitstun when being hit by a fuzzyguard but will otherwise remain standing until being hit or leaving blockstun.

Hmm let's make a list of games it's in/not in.

ST: No
VSav: No
SFA3: No
Garou: No
SF3: Yes
Jojo's: Yes
MB: Yes
GG: Yes
IaMP: Yes

I can't test CvS2 or MvC2 because I can't control player 2 in Null DC for some reason and the pause menu comes back as mojibake jibberish I can't read. And I don't really feel like testing Vanguard Princess or Akatsuki. And I vaguely recall it being in Monster.

[laugh]

More testing results:

I tried what Maj suggested and input a DP into an immediate block. If Guile did a reversal flashkick Ryu would block, and if the flashkick wasn't a reversal he'd DP through it. Though that doesn't really reveal anything useful.

FuzzyGuard does exist in SF4. No surprise there. But at least we know that both tripguard and fuzzyguard are in, just like every other capcom fighter.

That doesn't seem right, because if Guile didn't get a reversal move, he's supposed to get hit by the jumping attack. If you did an empty jump into DP while ending in DB, you will get a DP every single time regardless of what guilde does, effectively making it not an option select.

[Xenozip.]

Sorry I forgot to clarify I was purposefully whiffing an air attack in that last test. Specifically j.MP. Just for the sake of testing if a DP comes out at all or not during the dummy recording. I know whiffing the attack makes it not an option select but I was testing landing recovery caused from attacking in the air (whiff or not).

To summarize: The block tests were done with a proper setup, he can block with a properly timed jump attack or not attacking. And he can also DP when no air attack is used. The final test with the DP into downback was whiffing a j.MP in which he'd block a reversal and DP if it wasn't a reversal (which let me know that a DP input was in there somewhere).

So the issue is entirely the landing recovery from performing a jump attack. And while it was discovered there's trip guard that cancels said recovery (hence being able to block), I was unable to crouch cancel the trip guard into a DP during my tests, and I'm not sure if that's even possible or not against Guile's flash kick.

Why it's not possible to go into DP but you can block may be the same reason why you can only block after Chun's super flash, but I don't know. I just assume though that it takes at least 1 whole frame to first cancel the landing recovery into a crouch, the DP can't be on the simultaneous frame as the crouch cancel.

[laugh]

Sorry I forgot to clarify I was purposefully whiffing an air attack in that last test. Specifically j.MP. Just for the sake of testing if a DP comes out at all or not during the dummy recording. I know whiffing the attack makes it not an option select but I was testing landing recovery caused from attacking in the air (whiff or not).

To summarize: The block tests were done with a proper setup, he can block with a properly timed jump attack or not attacking. And he can also DP when no air attack is used. The final test with the DP into downback was whiffing a j.MP in which he'd block a reversal and DP if it wasn't a reversal (which let me know that a DP input was in there somewhere).

So the issue is entirely the landing recovery from performing a jump attack. And while it was discovered there's trip guard that cancels said recovery (hence being able to block), I was unable to crouch cancel the trip guard into a DP during my tests, and I'm not sure if that's even possible or not against Guile's flash kick.

Why it's not possible to go into DP but you can block may be the same reason why you can only block after Chun's super flash, but I don't know. I just assume though that it takes at least 1 whole frame to first cancel the landing recovery into a crouch, the DP can't be on the simultaneous frame as the crouch cancel.

I see, but I don't even think crouch canceling is in the mix here. If the flash kick wasn't a reversal, then it just makes that move slower and simply gives Ryu more time to get out of that "no specials timezone." There is no proof that it had anything to do with crouch cancels.

The issue here is the 2 frames immediately following landing recovery frames (which are also 2 frames) where you cannot perform any specials or jump but can block. There is no apparent reason for these added 2 frames of no nothing period, and these things do not exist in previous street fighter games AFAIK. What's more weird is that the same no jumping rule applies to the first 4 frames of landing even if you do an empty jump so there's no landing recovery.

[Xenozip.]

Actually I did test if Ryu could stand block and he can, so it's true that it might not have anything to do with Trip Guard. Unless guarding is the new "cancel trigger" rather than crouching?

Though Maj had said this before I even began testing:

In most Capcom fighting games you can't do a special move immediately when you land (and in certain other recovery situations). If you go frame by frame, you see your character do a normal move for one or two frames and then automatically cancel into whatever special move you attempted.

It's not a negative edge kara cancel because it happens even if you hold the button.

Which is probably what's actually happening.

Though I was inclined to believe tripguard because
1) I would block the reversal instead of getting hit/counterhit when holding downback and inputting a DP. If it's Maj's explanation then I should get hit/counter hit and he does not.
2) Because empty jump DP does work, he doesn't get hit or forced to block if he empty jumps, only if he attacks. That highly suggests tripguard because that's exactly how tripguard works (which is in a lot of capcom fighters and a lot of fighters in general).

[edit]: I just went into training mode and I can't replicate empty jump DP beating reversal flashkick but I could swear I got it earlier. This makes me wonder if I'm pressing the DP input too soon and it's registering an air attack and adding in recovery frames on landing, or if I somehow managed to crouch cancel into DP with that one dummy recording from earlier, or if I'm just on crack and imaged seeing "reversal" losing to DP.

[Edit2]: OK I just tried empty jump FA and whiff jump attack FA. And Backdash but that results in block.
Empty jump FA results in getting armor broken so you indeed can cancel that landing recovery if you empty jump. You can clearly hear the broken glass sound effect and it says "counter hit" on screen as well as "reversal".
Whiffing jump attack and FA, I have yet to get an armor break. Not sure if it's possible or not.

[Edit3]: Empty jump shinkuu worked, whiff jump attack shinkuu did not.

After these tests I'm fairly certain the landing recovery only occurs if you attack in the air, not if you empty jump, which would again imply tripguard. My question now is did they implement guarding in general as the trigger that allows you to cancel the recovery into block? They must have because whiffing an attack in the air you can still block high. That shouldn't be possible if there was a landing recovery unless the act of blocking is what cancels the landing recovery rather than crouching.

[Dark_Chaotix]

What's FuzzyGuard?

I know this term from Tekken. Since that game has string for its attacks they can be high, mid or low. So fuzzyguard work like say Paul does his d+2,4,1 (mid, low, mid) where he has a alternative string which is d+2, 1 (mid, mid). For this to work you stand block the mid for both combos then you would proceed to block low. Since the "4" in the first combo is quick compared to the "1" in the second combo, if you dont get a hit from the low in a few frames, they the only option is to stand which in turn block the mid finisher in the second combo. So basically you are blocking all options the opponent has when preforming those 2 strings. Hope that makes sense?!

In saying that, Im not really aware that fuzzyguard is in 2d games. I know its not used in Kof.... You have alt guard in certain kof games but thats about it.

[Xenozip.]

^ That's actually the correct definition of FuzzyGuard, in the sense that that's the definition the Japanese and 3D fighting game players use it. The 2D fighting game players use it incorrectly.

[Dark_Chaotix]

Thanks Xeno

So, in above post you mentioned that they exist in sf4? And what is trip guard?

[Xenozip.]

The correct definition of fuzzyguard, the one you described, may or may not exist in SF4. The one I was referring to as being in SF4 was the incorrect definition of it (the one that 2D fighting game players use), which is while-rising overheads (that I think are called Kamone or Ohage) that only work if you put the opponent into a stand block state first. Read my previous posts in this thread for a more detailed explanation (and video example).

Trip Guard is something Capcom implemented very early on in their fighting game series and is in quite a number of games. Normally there is a landing recovery when landing from a jump, but Capcom wanted you to be able to block sweeps when landing from a jump, so what they did was make this landing recovery cancelable by crouching. That way when the player lands from a jump they can't attack with a standing attack because of the landing recovery, but they could crouch block (or crouch-anything for that matter). This was called Trip Guard because it was specifically designed so that players who were landing from a jump could block sweeps and such.

It also led to crouch cancel infinites in SFA3, because crouching (tripguard) canceled the landing recovery. It's normally impossible to simply hold uptoward to do an A3 infinite, you must crouch cancel, which is abusing the trip guard function by canceling the land recovery into a crouch (tripguard) pose and then canceling the crouch animation into another jump.

I'm currently theorizing though that SF4's tripguard isn't triggered by a crouch, but rather by the act of blocking, which lets you cancel the landing recovery by blocking high as well as low (and not just by crouching).

[Dark_Chaotix]

Ah, thanks for that.

Could you show me an A3 example

[Raine]

I thought there was a pretty interesting combo at 4:55 in this match video. Sabin goes for the Yoga Fire + instant air teleport combo and ends up crossing up Fei-Long in midair. I've seen this combo plenty of times but never with a crossup like that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=56TOgYjbAls

[error1]

you want an example of sfa3 crouch canceling?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHZxQYpVhyc#t=1m05s