Terminology/Glossary Series

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onReload
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Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by onReload »

Hey, guys,

Something that's run through my mind for the past few years has been the idea of a video explaining terminology and/or base concepts for fighting games. I think this sort of thing is thought of/important every time a new release is happening or EVO is happening, so...here we go again. I'm thinking of mixing existing match footage with homemade clips, fyi. I don't know how professional I'd like it to be, if I should aim for pro tourney-worthy stuff (still an amateur at making things look nice so that might be a challenge) or just something that's fun for the new players.

I've looked at some other videos and Maj's old S/H Fighting Game Terminology article, and I'm trying to determine a few things before coming up with a master list:
  • Which terms/concepts are most crucial?
  • What order should terms go in?
  • Should I aim for professional style or keep it casual?
  • Should this be oriented mostly toward SF; how far out into other games should I go? Anime/marvel games? Not touching 3D; i have barely any knowledge of that stuff.
Anyway, here's a list of stuff I came up with in a few minutes. Please feel free to add/remove things you think are unimportant/important:
  • Normals
  • Specials
  • Supers
  • Combo
  • Cancel
  • Chain
  • Throw
  • AA
  • reversal
  • DP/uppercut/shoryu
  • move naming (typically used FGC naming conventions vs. official move names, i.e. saying "flash kick" when Remy's move is really something long and silly)
  • charge
  • Rekka
  • SPD
  • tiger knee/IA
  • chip/guard damage
  • OTG
  • meaty
  • dizzy/stun
  • block (cross-up/overhead/low)
  • mixup/okizeme/wakeup games
  • reset
  • footsies
  • zone
  • rushdown
  • startup/active/recovery
  • hitbox/hurtbox/all sorts of boxes
  • hitstun/blockstun
  • frame advantage
Doopliss
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Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by Doopliss »

Some other terms:
Space control (as in how a normal projectile covers a lot of horizontal space, a stationary projectile can cover a specific space on the field to limit options etc).
Safe/unsafe
Punish
Frame trap/Counterhit (And counterhit-specific properties/combos)
Block stun/block string
Option Select
Push Block/Alpha counter
Armor
Force stand/crouch
Juggle
Trade (When they're good, bad, done on purpose to allow for new combos etc)
Taunt (Since they can have their uses :P )
Yomi/Hard reads
A2A
BnB
dash/airdash
Bait/Whiff Punish

Wish I could help you with the rest, but I've always been the kind of guy that tries to develop in a vacuum as much as possible, so I don't know what's considered more crucial.
Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

http://www.youtube.com/user/DaDoppen
onReload
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Location: NJ, USA

Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by onReload »

Huh, thought I put taunt on that list. Whoops.

My favorite video someone's done so far is most likely this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nd9sEB6ku14 by GuileWinQuote. Tons of views which is good, but I'd like to break the concepts into separate clips so that it's easy for someone to search for "fighting game reversal" if they hear something they don't understand.

I forgot a few things, thought about this in the shower. That's where I get the best thinking done.

-Jump (basics are important)
-Crouch
-Notation (so kids can learn combos, HCF/DPM, numerical notation etc)
-Command move/normal (to clarify that "buttons" is, IMO, kind of a misleading term for normals as a whole)
-Kara
-Command grab
-Counter-hit

I definitely want to avoid obscure/single-series terms like "linkers" in KI and such. I think covering "anime" games is probably important as that's still a thriving genre, but I'll need some help with that. Probably will have to visit dustloop a bit.

I like your terms, these are great additions. I'll probably come up with a prototype video covering something basic in the near future.
onReload
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Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by onReload »

As usual, this is going to be harder than I thought.
I think I'm going to start with writing, then reading, then recording visuals. I've found it hard to record visuals then do audio after the fact.

If you ever wanted to know how noisy your house is, try doing something that requires a lot of quiet.

Here's a read-through of something I did for normal moves (normals)

http://1drv.ms/1QQZ26x
A normal is a move executed by pressing one button with no more than one directional input.
For this section, I'm only talking about moves where the character is on the ground; not jumping.

You have standing normals, where the player simply presses a button without inputting any direction.
There's crouching normals, where the player is inputting "down" and a button.
Then there's command normals, where a player inputs forward, back, down and forward, or down and back.

Some players use the term "buttons," which can be a bit confusing. Two entirely different moves may use the same button, so just try to think of the term "button" as "normal."
onReload
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Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by onReload »

Test of this sort of thing: https://www.twitch.tv/videos/160419538. No, you don't have to watch it all lol.

I just streamed the first chunk of terms, nobody was watching until towards the end so I wasn't interrupted. I was figuring I'd stream/record this stuff then chop it up later.

Pretty much starts at 2:40. Feedback is appreciated, and I know it's needed lol. A little rambly/stuttery, missed a few little things. But especially let me know about showing input - I don't (at the moment) have the means to do a proper camera mount to see a stick/pad, and I think the virtual stick might do the trick.

I also should do this at 1080p/60 fps eh?

Thanks!
onReload
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Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by onReload »

Here's a run at defining things quickly so I can avoid rambling and chop things into simple clips. Let me know what you think.

Normals- Moves done by pressing a button or by pressing a button with the stick held in a single direction. Also referred to as "buttons." Can be broken down into several sub-categories:
  • Far/Close normals - Some games have different standing moves per each button pressed dependent on if you're close to the opponent or far away.
  • Crouching normals - Buttons pressed while crouched (holding down on the stick). These do not change if you're close or far from the opponent.
  • Jumping normals - Done by pressing a button while airborne. Some games have different moves depending on if you're in a directional jump (back, or forward) or neutral jumping (straight up). Must be blocked while standing.
  • Command normals - Moves done by pressing a button while holding forward, back, down/forward or down/back on the stick.
Specials - Moves typically done by moving the stick in more than one direction then pressing a button
  • Quarter Circle Motion - Moving the stick 90 degrees (usually down to forward or down to back).
  • Half circle - Moving the stick 180 degrees. Can refer to back, down, forward (half-circle forward) and forward, down, back (half-circle back)
  • Dragon punch motion - Bringing the stick from forward, to down, to down/forward and pressing a button.
  • Charge motion - Holding one direction for a period of time then pressing another. Typically back to forward or down to up.
  • 360/SPD motion - Moving the stick in a full rotation. Typically doesn't matter if clockwise or counter-clockwise.
Supers - Moves typically inputted by doubling up special motions. Usually takes away from a meter or gauge that must be built up. Most games have their own names for these types of moves
Block/Guard - Where a character defends against an incoming attack, taking no or reduced damage. Traditionally done by holding "back" or "away" from the direction of the character or attack.
High attack - A move that misses crouching characters.
Mid attack - An attack that hits standing and crouching characters, but can be blocked standing or crouching.
Low attack - An attack that hits standing and crouching characters, but must be blocked crouching.
Overhead attack - A type of mid attack that must be blocked standing.
Cross-up - A move that appears to hit from the front but must be blocked from the opposite direction. Can also refer to the act of crossing up, where a character slips behind their opponent.
Combo - An un-interruptable series of moves that connect one after the other. Some games have mechanics that can free the opponent from the combo.
Cancel - Where a character interrupts one move with another.
  • Empty cancel - A move that is canceled without touching the opponent.
  • Kara cancel - Canceling a move's startup period into another move.
Chain - A series of normals that cancel into one another. Also called "target combos" in some street fighter games.
Throw - An unblockable, typically close range attack. Usually cannot be comboed into. Usually knocks opponent down.
AA/Antiair, a move or technique where a standing character hits an airborne opponent.
Reversal - A move performed at the earliest possible window after a recovery.
DP/Uppercut/Shoryu - A type of anti-air move where the attacking character rises up, usually has partial or full invincibility. Usually has a long recovery period.
Fireball/Hadouken/Projectile - A projectile attack that leaves the character. Typically long-ranged.
Flash Kick - A type of antiair attack involving a down-to-up charge, functions similarly to a shoryu.
Rekka- A type of special move where after the initial input, the character can repeat the motion for follow-up moves.
Tiger Knee/Instant Air - Inputting a move in such a way that combines the move's input with a jump, so that an aerial move comes out as soon as the character leaves the ground. Also refers to the motion of down, down/forward, forward, up/forward.
Chip/Block/Guard damage - Damage taken while a character is blocking.
OTG- "Off the ground." A move that can hit a knocked down opponent.
Meaty - Situation where a move connects during the later part of its animation.
Dizzy/Stun - A character is left in a totally vulnerable state where they cannot move, block, or perform any moves. Players can sometimes shorten the time where the character is dizzy by mashing buttons.
Mixup/Okizeme/Wakeup games - A situation where one character can use a variety of moves on a character getting up from a knockdown.
Reset - Can refer to a) intentionally ending a combo in order to start a new offense or b) where a character flips out of an aerial knockdown state.
Neutral - A state where neither player has a clear advantage.
Footsies - Mid-ranged ground-based aspect of fighting game strategy.
Zoning/Turtling - Keeping the opponent away, usually with long range attacks, including fireballs.
Rushdown - A style of play characterized by close-range aggression; the opposite of turtling.

***Stopping for now. Here's the rest of the list:


startup/active/recovery
hitbox/hurtbox/all sorts of boxes
hitstun/blockstun
frame advantage
Space control (as in how a normal projectile covers a lot of horizontal space, a stationary projectile can cover a specific space on the field to limit options etc).
Safe/unsafe
Punish
Frame trap/Counterhit (And counterhit-specific properties/combos)
Block stun/block string
Option Select
Push Block/Alpha counter
Armor
Force stand/crouch
Juggle
Trade (When they're good, bad, done on purpose to allow for new combos etc)
Taunt (Since they can have their uses :P )
Yomi/Hard reads
air-to-air
BnB
dash/airdash
Bait/Whiff Punish
Last edited by onReload on Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Rufus
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Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by Rufus »

People have tried to do glossary/tutorial things in the past. They're a lot of work and hard to do well.

http://combovid.com/forums/viewtopic.ph ... irm#p20986
onReload
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Location: NJ, USA

Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by onReload »

Rufus wrote:People have tried to do glossary/tutorial things in the past. They're a lot of work and hard to do well.

http://combovid.com/forums/viewtopic.ph ... irm#p20986
Well, I mean - how do you think i'm doing so far, just on definitions?
Rufus
Posts: 647
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2010 3:12 am

Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by Rufus »

onReload wrote:...

Well, I mean - how do you think i'm doing so far, just on definitions?
"Kara cancel" and "empty cancel" are the same. "Kara" is just Japanese for empty.

I tend to think that a "cross-up" is a move where it's not clear in which direction you need to block.

The terms that you want to have in the glossary will vary a bit depending on what game you're trying to primarily cover.
Doopliss
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Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by Doopliss »

Rufus wrote:I tend to think that a "cross-up" is a move where it's not clear in which direction you need to block.
That's an ambiguous or fake cross-up specifically. A cross-up is when you have to block the opposite way based on your original positions, I don't know if that's how it always was but that's how it is now, especially with games like SFV using the term in that fashion in-game.

Kara/empty cancel is indeed the same thing though, the difference is in what games they are used and what word is used in said game.
Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

http://www.youtube.com/user/DaDoppen
onReload
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Location: NJ, USA

Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by onReload »

Really? I know that Kara means empty in Japanese, though they actually don't use the term for the same meaning. I always thought kara cancel as like, cr.HK~LPshoryu with Ken in 3s, as in, 1st frame canceled into another move, but you can cancel whiffed moves in A2 into CCs. if you guys agree that they're the same then I'll just make them synonyms.

yeah for cross-up i'm putting it down as what it would register as in the game's code, how doopliss puts it. the fact that it can be ambiguous, i guess i can make that an extension of the definition.
Doopliss
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Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by Doopliss »

onReload wrote:I always thought kara cancel as like, cr.HK~LPshoryu with Ken in 3s, as in, 1st frame canceled into another move, but you can cancel whiffed moves in A2 into CCs.
Then you have weird middle-grounds like Sagat's f.LK and f.HK in SFIV that people still call kara even though you can cancel them during basically the entire start-up. I don't know if the term "whiff cancel" is used, but that'd be more fitting for the kind of empty cancels you see in games like MvC, KoF etc.
Maybe Doopliss isn't kicking ass, but he's taking names.

http://www.youtube.com/user/DaDoppen
Rufus
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Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2010 3:12 am

Re: Terminology/Glossary Series

Post by Rufus »

onReload wrote:Really? I know that Kara means empty in Japanese, though they actually don't use the term for the same meaning. I always thought kara cancel as like, cr.HK~LPshoryu with Ken in 3s, as in, 1st frame canceled into another move, but you can cancel whiffed moves in A2 into CCs. if you guys agree that they're the same then I'll just make them synonyms. ...
None of these definitions are going to be able to handle every case. If you're not shooting for the 10% of the work that covers 90% of the cases here, you'll only end up frustrated.

In Street Fighter 2, normal moves can be special cancelled up to the 4th frame and super cancelled up to the 5th frame, and those are definitely called kara cancels if the move doesn't hit.
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