SSF4:AE Combo Engine Investigation

[onReload]

Sadly, Evil Ryu and Oni don't bring much to the combo table so far; at least that's my impression. I'm sure you'll all want to see for yourselves, but when you get the chance to try out AE, I'd recommend Yun and Yang.

[Snoooootch]

Yup, and their Supers are straight up free combos. lol.

[Doopliss]

I'm sure Oni can do some cool juggles, as a lot of his moves seems to cause knockdown instead of reset. Also, doesn't his air dashes have hitboxes as well?

[error1]

I'm sure e. ryu can do some cool things with his j.mp and akuma's hurricane kick and red fireball

[Doopliss]

Also, I bet you can use E.Ryu's stomp and/or Oni's slash in FADC combos.

[onReload]

the stomp doesn't seem to have much in the way of FADC, e.ryu's j.MP is indeed like ryu's j.MP, but after 2 hits (air to air), messatsu shoryuken (U2) doesn't go cinematic - didn't get to try it after 1 hit.

i'm talking ground combos, dummy opportunities, etc...their bread and butters already very close to the ones that akuma and ryu already have, their tatsus aren't better, neither are the fireballs or pokes (though Oni's f+HP negates a fireball)...i'm hopeful about the airdashes with Oni, and he seems more interesting/different than e.ryu, but still, I think what will set them apart from other character's combo potential will be their specials/ultras...which are only interesting on day 1, imo.

I'm sure e. ryu can do some cool things with his j.mp and akuma's hurricane kick and red fireball

yeah, you can probably do (juggle)j.MP, land, LK Tatsu, HP Shoryu FADC Red Fireball...'cause i know the last part is possible on grounded opponents (akuma b&b). also, the teleport really is awful, it goes nowhere...and e.ryu doesn't have air demon, only oni.

i did forget about one thing, it should be interesting to see what will be possible with oni's ultra fireball variations (aerial, anti-aerial).

[Doopliss]

I know I will finish a combo with SRK FADC Air U1 in my first AE CMV, even if I have to do it on Dhalsims j.LP.

[onReload]

haha yeah, i need to find the input for the upward one, so I can do Shoryu FADC upward ultra, and see if it all hits...it would be weird to have one hit of the ultra go through, and the dummy falls on you or something

[error1]

I thought it was just qcfx2 kkk for the up hadou
as for e ryu I was thinking more along the lines of
lk tatsu vs a jumping limb, j.mp ( 1 hit ), lp srk, red fireball, ultra
I suspect he can do that without using any meter

[Doopliss]

it annoys me how they both had RD as super though. I wanted Shinku tatsumaki D:

[onReload]

^ Yeah, i wanted something else, but ex tatsu is already shinkuu tatsumaki, technically...ryu is kinda outta supers in sf4

[error1]

sfa2 evil ryu had demon, hadou, tatsu, and shoryu supers. They probley gave him demon for balancing reason, same reason Akuma can't get a good ultra.

[onReload]

i meant all his supers are in the agme, like, Gouken has Shin-Shoryuken and Denjin Hadouken; Ryu has Shinkuu Tatsumaki, Shinkuu Hadouken, Metsu Hadouken, and Metsu Shoryuken...all that would be left would be air fireball super or turning into ken and akuma (mvc1). so it would have to be a new thing

[error1]

Ryu had a boxing glove super in pocket fighter, they could bring that back. E. Ryu also had a lv3 beam super in motm, and don't get me started on sftmtg

[Doopliss]

and don't get me started on sftmtg

They should've given E.Ryu SHORUUKEN, TATSUMAKI KINAPPOO and HADUUKEN!

[Doopliss]

Btw, anyone knows if Elf's RSF is an infinite or a loop? Iirc, you can't do it forever even if you do it perfectly, or is that wrong?

[Rufus]

Btw, anyone knows if Elf's RSF is an infinite or a loop? Iirc, you can't do it forever even if you do it perfectly, or is that wrong?

In SF4 and SSF4, it's a loop. Every iteration, even if perfectly executed, will loose ground - the fierce punch does more knockback than the run will recover. Though it is infinite in practice mode with infinite meter and EX run. (That's one of the original test patterns I used.) The alternative run stop loops with cr. mk loose ground more quickly.

[Doopliss]

Ok, thanks for the answer.

[Pokey86]

Btw, anyone knows if Elf's RSF is an infinite or a loop? Iirc, you can't do it forever even if you do it perfectly, or is that wrong?

In SF4 and SSF4, it's a loop. Every iteration, even if perfectly executed, will loose ground - the fierce punch does more knockback than the run will recover. Though it is infinite in practice mode with infinite meter and EX run. (That's one of the original test patterns I used.) The alternative run stop loops with cr. mk loose ground more quickly.

Does that mean as a non-infinite can you do a couple of reps as standard run then cover lost ground with EX run & repeat 4 times over? for mximum amount of reps?

[Rufus]

Btw, anyone knows if Elf's RSF is an infinite or a loop? Iirc, you can't do it forever even if you do it perfectly, or is that wrong?

In SF4 and SSF4, it's a loop. Every iteration, even if perfectly executed, will loose ground - the fierce punch does more knockback than the run will recover. Though it is infinite in practice mode with infinite meter and EX run. (That's one of the original test patterns I used.) The alternative run stop loops with cr. mk loose ground more quickly.

Does that mean as a non-infinite can you do a couple of reps as standard run then cover lost ground with EX run & repeat 4 times over? for mximum amount of reps?

EX RSF breaks even.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMxTAT7UXJA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26Gmz4bUC6Y

[Maj]

Wow, nice. What made you choose Juri as the dummy?

So 1195 damage for 99 hits, at 7 damage per hit with minimum scaling. That means you need 72 fierces to break 1000 damage? Ouch.

[error1]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMxTAT7UXJA

that did 945 stun, with another ex run or a jump in or a counter hit that would dizzy right? Then you could do another 10 or so.
that seems like it would be worth doing

[Rufus]

Wow, nice. What made you choose Juri as the dummy?

She's the most Daipan friendly from a standing start.
RSF loop count with EX usage:

Code: Select all

10	Sakura
11	Hakan
12	Chun Li
12	Guy
12	Rose
14	Adon
14	Blanka
14	Cammy
14	Dhalsim
14	Dudley
14	Fei Long
14	Ken
14	Makoto
14	Rufus
14	Ryu
14	Sagat
14	Vega
15	Dan
15	Guile
15	Zangief
16	Bison
16	Cody
16	Gouken
16	Seth
16	Viper
17	Abel
17	Balrog
17	DeeJay
18	El Fuerte
18	Honda
18	Ibuki
19	Akuma
19	T Hawk
20	Juri

[Rufus]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMxTAT7UXJA

that did 945 stun, with another ex run or a jump in or a counter hit that would dizzy right? Then you could do another 10 or so.
that seems like it would be worth doing

The extra frames from counterhit give a free extra loop, so Juri dizzies on #15 (no EX usage), and then you can Lvl 3 focus, 19 fierces, and 3 crouching forwards the other way. Total damage would be around 777 modulo scaling. A similar combo vs Akuma would do around 719, Against T. Hawk you can run 18 fierces and 3 forwards one way, (leaving one EX bar) and probably 15 or 16 fierces plus 3 forwards after the dizzy. (Edit: Honda would probably be a better dummy for that than T Hawk.)

[Maj]

Dang, that's an impressive amount of research. I might have to try killing Akuma in SF4 or something. Seth isn't too far behind either. Though i bet these numbers change significantly after a jump attack.

[Rufus]

Dang, that's an impressive amount of research. I might have to try killing Akuma in SF4 or something. Seth isn't too far behind either. Though i bet these numbers change significantly after a jump attack.

RSF is better in SF4. I can test.... though I haven't unlocked Seth or Akuma in SF4 yet.

[desk]

@Rufus. wow, that inspired me to hit training mode and stop slacking with fuerte, lol. Don't know why but his RSF seemed much easier when I knew the theoretical maximum. Just capped this vs Juri...

j. HK, RSFx12, slide *stun* lv3FA, lv2FA, U2.
33hits.

Thanks for going to the effort to make those vids btw dude. Also, how was it better in vanilla?

[Rufus]

@Rufus. wow, that inspired me to hit training mode and stop slacking with fuerte, lol. Don't know why but his RSF seemed much easier when I knew the theoretical maximum. Just capped this vs Juri...

j. HK, RSFx12, slide *stun* lv3FA, lv2FA, U2.
33hits.

Thanks for going to the effort to make those vids btw dude. Also, how was it better in vanilla?

Close fierce does base 200 stun instead of 140, so, for example, you can RSF dizzy Gief, which is effectively impossible in SSF4.... though I suppose that can also be worse.... Hmm. He didn't have the Q-Bomb FADC juggle in the corner, so... Vanilla's is probably worse.

[onReload]

Hmmm, I wanted to test if you could juggle after Q.Bomb in Super...so could you do my theoretical Seth-dizzy of J.HP, cl.HP xx EX Quesadilla FADC EX Guacamole? Maybe you'd need one RSF in there...you can't kill Seth with Elf either way, but you can do some huge damage.

[Rufus]

Hmmm, I wanted to test if you could juggle after Q.Bomb in Super...so could you do my theoretical Seth-dizzy of J.HP, cl.HP xx EX Quesadilla FADC EX Guacamole? Maybe you'd need one RSF in there...you can't kill Seth with Elf either way, but you can do some huge damage.

You can only FADC into LK Guacamole.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eZVOrp1Gki4

Otherwise J. HP, cl HP, EX Quesadilla, FADC EX Guacamole ... U2 would be pretty close to doing Seth in.