SF4 Biweekly TACV Series

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 2:04 am

Whiff jab is just for style, although it's pretty much the only thing fast enough to fit between EX SBK and ultra. I would've preferred to whiff s.MK since that also has the whole "whiff a neutral move before a charge ultra" mystique, but it was way too slow. So it's either whiff a jab or crouch/walk/wiggle, and the jab seemed like the more stylish option. Also because SlimX thought the jab was funny, so i didn't want to remove it entirely.

Yeah it's damn near impossible to get all 19 juggle hits against Abel after EX Lightning Legs. You have to do the ultra pretty late so that you get the ultra's first five lightning legs hits to connect, but then the launcher tends to whiff, so the window is only like 2 frames. It might even be impossible unless you start midscreenish. It's a lot easier after EX SBK because it's much easier to avoid slipping into the corner.

You can also get 19 hits with a different pattern after EX SBK - like four lightning legs hits, then whiff two, then the last one connects, then the launcher still hits late enough to get the full upspin count. I don't know, it's kind of temperamental.

Pokey86 · Post by **Pokey86** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 12:22 am

I remeber those suggestions, some good ones i think.

Damn, only just noticed the Chun TACV was complete.

33-50 was beautiful

I also loved the final combo, i love post death combos.& Hazanshu was the last move i'd expect you to get all versions of.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:07 am

That's kind of funny actually, because i'd totally forgotten that whole discussion about combo challenges (except maybe subconsciously?)

Anyway my whole goal with that combo was HK Hazanshu (LP FB connects), MK Hazanshu, meaty s.LP, c.HP (one hit) xx HP FB xx lvl2 FA xx dash forward, LK Hazanshu, c.LK -> meaty s.LP, s.MP (KO) xx HK Hazanshu. It's all strictly functional. You need HK Hazanshu for the distance it covers, you need MK Hazanshu for the extra frame advantage, and you need LK Hazanshu after the lvl2 Focus Attack.

Unfortunately the only viable candidate for that whole thing seems to be crouching Seth, and that last Hazanshu misses him as he falls. It misses Sagat too, which is why i had to kill him with s.LP instead of s.MP or c.MK at the end. So then i noticed she builds enough meter for EX Hazanshu and opted for that instead of the HK version - even though i still think the HK version looks cooler after KO because that yellow EX effect is too distracting.

If i ever do an episode of failed combos, i'm definitely gonna include that last Hazanshu whiffing against Seth. Then again, maybe there's a viable dummy candidate in SSF4.

Pokey86 · Post by **Pokey86** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:15 pm

I see, i also wondered, if you did post death Hazanshu can you Focus attack after? Hazanshu causes stun on standing so theoretically it'd work.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:50 pm

Pokey86 · Post by **Pokey86** » Fri Jan 07, 2011 1:04 am

Maj wrote:Yup.

Cool, i guess that means if someone super charges during the startup of hazanshu you could cancel it in to super. Probably wouldn't be worthwhile mind, bit of a novelty though.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Fri Jan 07, 2011 10:37 am

That would look pretty cool if you made the Hazanshu kill the opponent, since Chun's superfreeze would occur after the KO. Someone should record that.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 1:23 pm

Sweet, i killed maskless Vega.

Don't look if you don't want spoilers ...

The trick was using EX Lightning Legs. More damage than EX SBK, with less stun per hit.

Chun Li counterhit vertical j.HP vs maskless Vega, s.HK xx EX Lightning Legs (four hits), EX SBK (Vega dizzy), vertical j.HP, EX Lightning Legs (four hits), EX SBK, ultra (nineteen hits) (1041 damage)

Pokey86 · Post by **Pokey86** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 7:23 pm

Excellent, i had no idea EX Legs does more than SBK

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Damn, when did you release the combo challenge, you've had loads of responses... The three i was gonna do are done (Ken SRK's, Saks Tatsu & Saks SRKs) but yeah there are plenty using projectiles. (i've have made hardmode no dizzy & projectiles omitted.)

But stil, some responses are really good.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:12 pm

I made it public at around 6am on Friday, so it's been 29 responses (plus a few rejected ones) in a little over two days. Not bad, right? Especially considering it didn't even get posted on SRK this time.

Doopliss · Post by **Doopliss** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:32 pm

Concidering that this doesn't work with a lot of moves, it's impressive indeed. However, I'm suprised no one has done anything with DeeJay's Air Slasher yet though, You can easily do a hard mode solution with that.

You should do the "do a 10% damage super" one next, because it would be very different from this one, as in this one, you couldn't use the super, and in that one, you can't use EX moves. Hard mode: No focus attacks.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:57 pm

Honestly the whole reason i made this one was because it bothered me having "SSF4 Combo Challenge 01" without any follow-ups. Now i've got a "02" and as far as i'm concerned, that loose end is neatly tied up.

These challenge vids really take too damn long to prepare, and then i have to monitor the results constantly for a week. It was fun at first, before i realized how much total time they cost when all is said and done.

Anyway if i decide to do another one, it'll probably be through ComboVid - starting from 01 again, maybe with a different naming/numbering system.

Btw i thought you released all the combos you were saving for that "10% super" challenge?

Doopliss · Post by **Doopliss** » Sun Jan 09, 2011 10:32 pm

I was only saving one, and it's gone, yes. But I want to see what other people come up with. Maybe I can make a challenge video myself, and you promote it?

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:00 am

Alright i got that Chun death combo recorded the way i want it, although it took much longer than i would've liked. In case anyone cares, that same combo does 849 damage against Dhalsim. Not quite close.

She has a lot more potential than i realized before i started her episode, but she's got plenty of heartbreak as well - mostly in the form of disappearing Kikokens. But she's got tons of random crap like EX SBK x4 in the corner, all kinds of side switch shenanigans with her B+MK chain and EX Lightning Legs FADC in the corner, counterhit meaty c.LP into stomp, and so on. They didn't give her the best of everything, but they pretty much gave her everything.

Also i tried trading with the launcher of her ultra and it seems to be a simple (high/drifting) knockdown. No juggle state or anything, and you lose over half the damage. It would be useful for another character, but Chun has several better knockdowns.

Anyway i might try one more combo and then move on to Balrog. He's gonna be late btw, but he's not that complicated so i should be done this week.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:22 am

Nevermind, it didn't work. I wanted to trade Chun's lvl3 Focus Attack against Rose's j.LK, then reversal HP Kikoken xx super so that only the last hit of her super connects, then interrupt that with LP Soul Spark, then juggle with stomps or whatever.

But the stage is way too short, so they can't outrun Rose's LP fireball fast enough. It's alright, wasn't that exciting anyway.

Snoooootch · Post by **Snoooootch** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 10:38 am

Not even with Light kick super? Cause launching the opponent could even allow one to land U1, right? Or am I understanding it wrong?

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Jan 18, 2011 11:15 am

I can get ultra to connect, but that's not too interesting because ultra has infinite juggle potential. I mean for another character it might be worthwhile, but for Chun it just seems forced, especially with the long Rose setup.

If i really wanted to connect super and ultra, i could just do j.HK, s.HK xx super (LP Soul Spark interrupt), ultra and probably get the full super.

I might even be able to get the first hit of the super to connect and then do stomps, but that's not interesting to me either. I only care about landing the last hit and that's hella impossible.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Jan 25, 2011 10:18 pm

I've got three combos recorded for Balrog, with two or three (or possibly four) more on the way.

He has some really buff dizzy combos, so a lot of this process is trying to figure out what to put in which combo to avoid repeating any concepts. For example i want to get a maximum Dash Upper combo, but it looks like i'm gonna have to settle with doing it against Seth because it doesn't work against Viper the way i want. That means i might have another dizzy combo against Viper, but i have to figure out all the remaining combos before recording any of them, so i'm in the middle of that.

Anyway i'm pretty happy with the way it's going. I mean he's no Dhalsim, but he's still interesting (to me at least).

Pokey86 · Post by **Pokey86** » Tue Jan 25, 2011 10:46 pm

you probably know, but you can link a super after a grounded Ultra (with the right position)

IF you can figure a normal combo that ends with Balrog performing a grounded ultra with no meter used, might look nice.

what springs to mind is a combo leading to rogs jab -> Ultra

then tack a super at the end of it, though going by your previous works in this series, it might seem a bit basic i guess.

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I can get ultra to connect, but that's not too interesting because ultra has infinite juggle potential. I mean for another character it might be worthwhile, but for Chun it just seems forced, especially with the long Rose setup.

If i really wanted to connect super and ultra, i could just do j.HK, s.HK xx super (LP Soul Spark interrupt), ultra and probably get the full super.

I might even be able to get the first hit of the super to connect and then do stomps, but that's not interesting to me either. I only care about landing the last hit and that's hella impossible.

hmm, if you did

neutral jump fierce -> stand Roundhouse -> Super (trade) -> Ultra

against Seth wouldn't that kill him? (Though, is seths LP boom slow enough to set up a trade for that?) & personally i've never seen Super traded to ultra, i think it'd look nice, good for cheap thrills anyway.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Jan 25, 2011 11:04 pm

I was trying Balrog jump over Sagat LK FB xx lvl3 EX Focus Attack, counterhit Final TAP xx super (LK FB interrupt), ultra but it seems way too slow. I don't think it's worth killing Seth with Balrog because it's a waste of damage potential. If he dies, he dies ... but i'm not gonna force it.

Plus the ultra to super juggle will probably be used in the KO combo, after Final TAP trade. I wanted to juggle super after a midscreen ultra, but i didn't know that Rog's super doesn't have infinite juggle potential. That's too bad, but i guess it would've been commonplace already if it was possible.

I probably won't have meaty s.LP, ground ultra in this video because that's in literally every Balrog combovid ever and i'm tired of seeing it. Maybe if i find another button to link from, but even that seems boring to be honest. Plus there's plenty of ultra in this video. Too much ultra. He can juggle it after literally everything except sweeps.

Btw if anyone was wondering whether armor break counterhit grants additional frame advantage - it doesn't :(

Pokey86 · Post by **Pokey86** » Tue Jan 25, 2011 11:17 pm

Maj wrote:
Btw if anyone was wondering whether armor break counterhit grants additional frame advantage - it doesn't

nuts, i really thought it would, it looks like it does but that's probably the hit stun.

Hmm, if you want a damage combo, it's simplistic but

Final CH TAP (Trade) -> Ultra -> Super but that seems a little small & meagre to be honest.

could easily work out to the strongest combo in the game though.

Can you use a trade to do 2 taps in a row?... Unlikely but FTAP (Hit trade) -> FTAP (Projectile Trade) -> Ultra -> Super would be such a great combo

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Regarding Chuns Super Trade:

hmmm

Neutral jump Fierce (338 Stun) -> Close HK (+200 = 538) -> Legs (+144? = 682) -> Far Fierce (+140 = 822) Super (Trade) -> Stomps (822 + 25 + 20 + 15 = 882)

That's very close to stunning Guile... i might be wrong on the stun that legs causes though.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Tue Jan 25, 2011 11:33 pm

Turn Punch has 30 frames of startup but only causes 21 frames of hit stun, like a normal hard attack. Trading with a fireball puts you even at best. That means you can't even combo a jab, much less another TAP.

Basically the only hope of comboing two of them is to start off with KKK Final TAP, then dizzy with kicks only, then PPP Final TAP. I'll give that a shot but i don't know if it'll work, or how cool it would look to end with plain Final TAP after dizzy. I could do lvl3 Focus Attack xx dash forward, Final TAP but 36 frames of recovery means i probably can't even juggle ultra.

And the problem with counterhit Final TAP trade is that only Rose can set it up in SF4, and she doesn't have enough vitality to make it worthwhile.

error1 · Post by **error1** » Tue Jan 25, 2011 11:42 pm

Pokey86 wrote: Hmm, if you want a damage combo, it's simplistic but

Final CH TAP (Trade) -> Ultra -> Super but that seems a little small & meagre to be honest.

I did that for the damage expo, it kills blanka

this combo doesn't work on akuma, if you could find a way to do 900 dizzy it would work
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7-E-cvbD2k
Tap has a surprisingly poor damage to stun ratio
it deals 946 damage btw and the last tap does 112 damage at 20% damage

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 3:14 am

Haha oh yeah, i forgot you did that double Final TAP dizzy combo already. I don't know, i'll mess around with it for a little bit and see what happens. There's always Rose too - kind of a longshot with 1000 stun. Though i'm sure you could eliminate some of those s.LK's, especially the first one after starting the first EX Dash Upper from so far away.

Also i keep forgetting that you can't do Focus Attack into Final TAP. I guess i'm too used to thinking of TAP as a two-button move from CvS2.

Snoooootch · Post by **Snoooootch** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 3:37 am

For tap, you can't hold all punches? I thought you could do either or.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 3:39 am

Focus Attack requires one of each, so you're screwed either way.

error1 · Post by **error1** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 3:49 am

is there a character that can be hit tap, ex fa?
doesn't seem to work on most characters but it works on block

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 3:54 am

This seems like the optimal hypothetical configuration: Balrog counterhit Final TAP vs Rose s.LK, EX dashupper, c.LK xx EX dashupper, c.LK xx EX dashupper, c.LK xx EX dashupper, s.LK, c.LK xx HK dashupper (363+200+40+140+30+100+20+60+10+5+20=988stun)

He might run into a charge time issue, but i'm sure he can get at least half of them without having to resort to two light attack fillers. Though i seriously doubt Rose would survive long enough to get dizzy. Plus i really don't want to use another LP Soul Spark setup for this combo.

Without counterhit, we're looking at 915 stun - and the last hit is worth 20, which makes it perfect for a 900 stun character. And they're more likely to survive long enough to get dizzy. But if that last Final TAP doesn't kill them, it's gonna seem kind of anticlimactic.

The problem is, i know i can dizzy a 950 stun character with Rog. I can't include both because they would probably look too redundant, so i guess i'll try both and decide when it's time to edit the video.

Has anyone seen a 950-stun Balrog combo? If it's already been done, i'd rather skip it.

error1 wrote:is there a character that can be hit tap, ex fa?

Yeah, Honda can. Maybe a few others. Seth can't for sure.

Snoooootch · Post by **Snoooootch** » Wed Jan 26, 2011 3:56 am

Maj wrote:Focus Attack requires one of each, so you're screwed either way.

Oh, idiot me. haha. Perhaps you can hit a character with Buffalo headbutt and launch the opponent in a weird direction that sends him behind rog and you can do that charge trick and land U1 backwards. like maybe with vega's sky claw.

Maj · Post by **Maj** » Thu Jan 27, 2011 7:37 am

Damn, i think Balrog is only 2 points shy of being able to dizzy Rose, but the combo only works in Training Mode because she dies way before the end. And of course you can end it with headbutt to ultra for even more damage.

Balrog counterhit Final TAP vs Rose s.LK, EX dashupper, s.LK xx EX dashupper, s.LK xx EX dashupper, s.LK xx EX dashupper, c.LP, c.LP, c.MP xx HP headbutt (363+200+40+140+30+100+20+60+10+5+10+20=998stun)

Not sure what the damage is because i want to finish this video by Friday and it wouldn't be included anyway, but it's gotta be north of 1100. First two hits are 840 already! Not that it matters, since counterhit Final TAP, ultra, super will probably do way more damage.

edit: Scratch that, Rog can definitely dizzy Rose.

Balrog counterhit Final TAP vs Rose s.LK, HK dashupper xx FADC, c.LP, s.HK, c.MP xx EX dashupper, s.LK xx EX dashupper, c.LP, c.LP, c.MP xx HP headbutt (363+200+40+140+60+100+20+60+10+5+10+20=1028stun)

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